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Alessandro Volta
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

VM and IPv6

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Message 912 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media


@legacy1 wrote:
VM could be delaying IPv6 because of tracking easy to track one IP then a subnet
Why even if VM ultimately give out a /56  Most users will end up using a single /64 so tracking IP addresses back to an individual account wouldn't be that hard.
and even if not that some expect to keep the same IPv6 subnet but likely changing your MAC will get you a new IPv6 subnet.
Virgin Media would see which account had which /64 and when in the same way they can see which account was using an IPv4 address at a given time.
Then their how DDNS would work with IPv6 with would mean the router can not do DDNS IPv6 because how would it know what IP to send so a software on the device would have to be used.
Not an issue for Virgin Media.  Rather an issue for DDNS providers.
And lets not forget the LAN for IPv6 and security no doubt VM would need to block ports 135,137,138,139,445 for IPv6 or how about a firewall in the hub that allow all outgoing but then need to have rules for incoming that work.
Again not an issue, provided the hub supports IPv6 firewalling.  Users will have to either set up a static IPv6 address or turn off privacy addressing so that a device they want to run the server on ONLY uses it's EUI 64 address.  On the IPv4 front the router would still be using NAT.  Add to that Windows itself actually denies connections from outside the same subnet by default on IPv6.  The only fly in the ointment is teredo.

No I don't see IPv6 happing any time soon.
All good things come to he who waits. As I said before, if the trial of DS-Lite  had gone well, then Virgin Media would have gone ahead and deployed IPv6 by now,


 

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Message 913 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

and even if not that some expect to keep the same IPv6 subnet but likely changing your MAC will get you a new IPv6 subnet.
Virgin Media would see which account had which /64 and when in the same way they can see which account was using an IPv4 address at a given time.

And changing your MAC or hub in router mode will change your IPv4 and IPv6 and some want the same IPv6 which VM have no system in place to do that or put this way have VM a system for you to keep the same IPv4 even when change your MAC or hub? No!

 

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Message 914 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

I think IPv6 router/gateways/IspModem will be stateful, so legacy's fear of every port being open shouldn't be the case.

I have some older gear her and honestly the IPv6 configuration on the stuff is difficult when it comes to firewall rules.  UPnP in the future should still be needed, but instead of NAT+Firewall(IPv4) it will just be Firewall(IPv6).  Getting rid of PAT will be a plus too, unless ISP's become aggressive at blocking ports, then PAT will have a role again.

I had more typed out but It timed out so meh, not rambling all over again ;P...

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I would also make websites for them, because the job never seems to require the website to work.
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Message 915 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media


@legacy1 wrote:

and even if not that some expect to keep the same IPv6 subnet but likely changing your MAC will get you a new IPv6 subnet.
Virgin Media would see which account had which /64 and when in the same way they can see which account was using an IPv4 address at a given time.

And changing your MAC or hub in router mode will change your IPv4 and IPv6 and some want the same IPv6 which VM have no system in place to do that or put this way have VM a system for you to keep the same IPv4 even when change your MAC or hub? No!

 


I would think the IPv6 block will be handed out by the Modem, so equipment changes other than modem shouldn't cause a loss of the IP block.

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I do not work for VM, but I would. It is just a Job.
Most things I say I make up and sometimes it's useful, don't be mean if it's wrong.
I would also make websites for them, because the job never seems to require the website to work.
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Message 916 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

Well VM have not done a stateful firewall (with rules) for IPv4 in modem mode so what odds are they going to do it for IPv6? I still think VM will do NAT for IPv6 just because its understood and will just get one IPv6 in modem mode too and router makers will just add a NAT option for IPv6.

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Message 917 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

I think the main worry for VM support will be all the people who have been advised to get their own router and will not have a clue about IPv6 and its addressing scheme. 


Tudor
There are 10 types of people: those who understand binary and those who don't and F people out of 10 who do not understand hexadecimal c1a2a285948293859940d9a49385a2
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Message 918 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

They will definitely not do NAT for IPv6.

It adds a layer of complication and they will be glad to see it gone.

It should have been possible for you to keep the same IPv4 under Virgin, and perhaps the block assignment will not be handed to the equipment by the Modem, I think that would be bad, but perhaps it will and I am not understanding of how servers can allocate this stuff.

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I do not work for VM, but I would. It is just a Job.
Most things I say I make up and sometimes it's useful, don't be mean if it's wrong.
I would also make websites for them, because the job never seems to require the website to work.
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Message 919 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

But what if you move house will their be a routing system that moves the IPv6 block over? I think VM will just have sticky IP block's for IPv6 and people can't expect the same IPv6 block which I'm fine with but others might not be.

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Message 920 of 1,146
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Re: IPv6 support on Virgin media

The way it work right now the IPv4 is that the MAC address of your router is used (via DHCPv4) to assign you an IP address. The way that some dual-stack ISP connections work is that you use stateful DHCPv6 to do the same thing. If (as Ravenstar68 suggested) VM are regrouping to deploy dual-stack this is the route I would expect them to take.

In Modem Mode the MAC address used is of the router you provide and is nothing to do with your Hub, that is just acting as an Ethernet bridge forwarding the packets back and forth. Keep the same router and you should be able to move (within a given geography) and keep your IP address. I'm sure others will correct me if I'm wrong here...😉

How sticky the IP address(s) are will depend on how they implement things. Right now the IPv4 address we get is fairly sticky (for me over the past 20 years I've only had about 6 addresses or so) but when they do a bit of network reorg. With IPv6 this could get to be a bit of a pain in the butt as internal network devices will have to change their address. Not something we need to think about with IPv4 NAT at the moment. I wonder how that will go. Personally I hope that the address range was tied to my account (as it is with my Hurricane Electric tunnel) but there are obviously privacy implications to that.

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