Video Output Settings

[anap]

Please could someone tell me if the Video Output Settings have been corrected in the V6. i.e. Do they now work like they are described in the info screen or are they like the TiVo but with extra 2160 settings?

[crypticc]

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@bolgerp wrote:

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@crypticc wrote:

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@Gmjh wrote:

Actually come to think of it you have to disable 1080p or it'll show tv 1080i as 1080p. So just have 1080i and 2160p pass through selected for the best of a bad bunch.

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Will cause SD channels to be scaled twice.

Once by TiVo from SD to 1080i

And again by TV from 1080i to 2160.

Deselect 1080 much cleaner when watching SD. Then re-enable for HD.

Also fairly certain at least some HD channels are actually 720 on Virgin which is why they sometimes look better selecting that. Mostly Sky channels it seems.   Maybe definition of "HD" wasn't specified when contracts were signed?

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Do you mean manually change the video setting everytime when switching between SD and HD? That seems like a complete pain in the backside... 

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Yes. And it is.  Courtesy of Virgin TiVo

[minion101]

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 wrote:

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No - if you set it like that you’ll probably get everything shown as 1080i irrespective of whether it’s 520, 720, 1080 or 4K that’s being transmitted.

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That's not the case. One of the few things the V6 will do correctly is show 1080i as 1080i and also pass through 4k as 4k. 

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I’m afraid it is the case. With a 4K TV and 1080i and the two 2160 options selected on V6 then:-

SD / 520 upscaled to 1080i by V6 (and then upscaled again by 4K TV - not good)

1080i transmitted correctly as 1080i

BT sport 4K UHD downscaled to 1080i - not good

If you use the V6 for any 4K or SD content and don’t want to change the settings every time you change channel then the least bad option is to just select the two 2160 options. This shouldn’t be how it works but unfortunately it is. Two separate upscales for SD content and downscaling 4K to 1080i far from ideal.

[Gmjh]

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@minion101 wrote:

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 wrote:

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No - if you set it like that you’ll probably get everything shown as 1080i irrespective of whether it’s 520, 720, 1080 or 4K that’s being transmitted.

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That's not the case. One of the few things the V6 will do correctly is show 1080i as 1080i and also pass through 4k as 4k. 

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I’m afraid it is the case. With a 4K TV and 1080i and the two 2160 options selected on V6 then:-

SD / 520 upscaled to 1080i by V6 (and then upscaled again by 4K TV - not good)

1080i transmitted correctly as 1080i

BT sport 4K UHD downscaled to 1080i - not good

If you use the V6 for any 4K or SD content and don’t want to change the settings every time you change channel then the least bad option is to just select the two 2160 options. This shouldn’t be how it works but unfortunately it is. Two separate upscales for SD content and downscaling 4K to 1080i far from ideal.

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It may well be the case that 4k BT Sport gets down scaled to 1080i (I've never tried 4k bt sport) but if so that's the exception not the rule. With all other 4k sources, Netflix , YouTube, etc, the V6 will pass through 4k while also switching to 1080i for HD broadcast TV.  Why it doesn't do it for 4k bt sport, and only 4k bt sport, I have no idea. 

[dante01]

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@Gmjh wrote:

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It may well be the case that 4k BT Sport gets down scaled to 1080i (I've never tried 4k bt sport) but if so that's the exception not the rule. With all other 4k sources, Netflix , YouTube, etc, the V6 will pass through 4k while also switching to 1080i for HD broadcast TV.  Why it doesn't do it for 4k bt sport, and only 4k bt sport, I have no idea. 

No. It's the rule and not the exception. You'd not get the native 2160p 50Hz video if you'd any resolution selected apart from the 2160p option at the top of the settings which also results in all lesser resolutions being scaled up to this by the V6 prior to output. 2160p at 50Hz is the broadcast standard for all UK UHD 4K TV broadcasts. Netflix and YouTube are not TV channels and are streaming services under the influence of the 24, 25 and 30 fps  passthrough settings due to their content not having a framerate of 50Hz and using frames rates of 24, 25 or 30 fps that are more associated with film than TV.

The 2160p setting isn't scaling native 4K UHD TV channels up to this resolution and 2160p at 60Hz is their native resolution as broadcasted by that channel. The setting allows such content to bypass the receivers scaling if set to the 2160p setting, but also means that all channels using a lower resolution will be scaled up to this resolution by the V6.

There is no 4K 50Hz passthrough option and this is the resolution and frame rate used for UK UHD TV channels. TV broadcasters do not use 24, 25 or 30 fps frame rates and these are the only frames rates the V6 has passthrough options for.

[valleyboy22]

I have come to the conclusion that 720p settings on the box is the overall best for me. HD is great and the SD is ok i suppose at this setting, because not all channels i watch are HD so need a balance.

[Gmjh]

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@dante01 wrote:

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@Gmjh wrote:

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It may well be the case that 4k BT Sport gets down scaled to 1080i (I've never tried 4k bt sport) but if so that's the exception not the rule. With all other 4k sources, Netflix , YouTube, etc, the V6 will pass through 4k while also switching to 1080i for HD broadcast TV.  Why it doesn't do it for 4k bt sport, and only 4k bt sport, I have no idea. 

No. It's the rule and not the exception. You'd not get the native 2160p 50Hz video if you'd any resolution selected apart from the 2160p option at the top of the settings which also results in all lesser resolutions being scaled up to this by the V6 prior to output. 2160p at 50Hz is the broadcast standard for all UK UHD 4K TV broadcasts. Netflix and YouTube are not TV channels and are streaming services under the influence of the 24, 25 and 30 fps  passthrough settings due to their content not having a framerate of 50Hz and using frames rates of 24, 25 or 30 fps that are more associated with film than TV.

The 2160p setting isn't scaling native 4K UHD TV channels up to this resolution and 2160p at 60Hz is their native resolution as broadcasted by that channel. The setting allows such content to bypass the receivers scaling if set to the 2160p setting, but also means that all channels using a lower resolution will be scaled up to this resolution by the V6.

There is no 4K 50Hz passthrough option and this is the resolution and frame rate used for UK UHD TV channels. TV broadcasters do not use 24, 25 or 30 fps frame rates and these are the only frames rates the V6 has passthrough options for.

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I see the point you're making now. By there is vastly more 4k content on Netflix and YouTube than on tv broadcast 4k. You speak of 'UK uhd channels' but there's virtually none and virtually no broadcast 4k tv. So it's the exception not the rule. 

[crypticc]

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@dante01 wrote:

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@Gmjh wrote:

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It may well be the case that 4k BT Sport gets down scaled to 1080i (I've never tried 4k bt sport) but if so that's the exception not the rule. With all other 4k sources, Netflix , YouTube, etc, the V6 will pass through 4k while also switching to 1080i for HD broadcast TV.  Why it doesn't do it for 4k bt sport, and only 4k bt sport, I have no idea. 

No. It's the rule and not the exception. You'd not get the native 2160p 50Hz video if you'd any resolution selected apart from the 2160p option at the top of the settings which also results in all lesser resolutions being scaled up to this by the V6 prior to output. 2160p at 50Hz is the broadcast standard for all UK UHD 4K TV broadcasts. Netflix and YouTube are not TV channels and are streaming services under the influence of the 24, 25 and 30 fps  passthrough settings due to their content not having a framerate of 50Hz and using frames rates of 24, 25 or 30 fps that are more associated with film than TV.

The 2160p setting isn't scaling native 4K UHD TV channels up to this resolution and 2160p at 60Hz is their native resolution as broadcasted by that channel. The setting allows such content to bypass the receivers scaling if set to the 2160p setting, but also means that all channels using a lower resolution will be scaled up to this resolution by the V6.

There is no 4K 50Hz passthrough option and this is the resolution and frame rate used for UK UHD TV channels. TV broadcasters do not use 24, 25 or 30 fps frame rates and these are the only frames rates the V6 has passthrough options for.

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You mention 2160/50 and 2160/60

In my experience routing the TiVo through the Oppo to display the frame rate etc the TiVo assumed/50 for YouTube always.  Whether /24/25/30 or 50. It doesn't pass through YouTube.   But then I use other platforms for that . Have given up on tivo for anything except HD regular programming

[minion101]

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@Gmjh

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I see the point you're making now. By there is vastly more 4k content on Netflix and YouTube than on tv broadcast 4k. You speak of 'UK uhd channels' but there's virtually none and virtually no broadcast 4k tv. So it's the exception not the rule. 

There is at present but 

- UHD red button trials

- Iplayer UHD /HLG 

also did not work if anything other than 2160 selected.

The important point though is that the current video option settings remain bugged / flawed. I suspect that different people will find different options work best depending on what they mostly watch and the characteristics of their 4K TV upscaler. For me the simplest is the two 2160 options only as this allows BT sport 4K and avoids double upscale of SD content.

[Gmjh]

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@minion101 wrote:

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@Gmjh

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I see the point you're making now. By there is vastly more 4k content on Netflix and YouTube than on tv broadcast 4k. You speak of 'UK uhd channels' but there's virtually none and virtually no broadcast 4k tv. So it's the exception not the rule. 

There is at present but 

- UHD red button trials

- Iplayer UHD /HLG 

also did not work if anything other than 2160 selected.

The important point though is that the current video option settings remain bugged / flawed. I suspect that different people will find different options work best depending on what they mostly watch and the characteristics of their 4K TV upscaler. For me the simplest is the two 2160 options only as this allows BT sport 4K and avoids double upscale of SD content.

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Yes you're right. In future this bug will become much more of an issue for all customers. Maybe then they'll finally get round to actually fixing it. At the moment Virgin (and the people who moderate this thread) are just pretending it doesn't exist.

[dante01]

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@crypticc wrote:

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In my experience routing the TiVo through the Oppo to display the frame rate etc the TiVo assumed/50 for YouTube always.  Whether /24/25/30 or 50. It doesn't pass through YouTube.   But then I use other platforms for that . Have given up on tivo for anything except HD regular programming

YouTube video at 50Hz would therefore be subject to the V6's scaler and the associated video output settings other than the passthrough options then. Only video that has the corresponding resolution and frame rate associated with the 2 passthrough options can be passed throough the V6 without being subject to the V6's scaler. If you have the 2160p option selected then everything you access via Youtube that has a 50Hz frame rate will be scaled to 2160p.