Multiple Router Restarts

[Haravikk]

I've always had some trouble with Virgin routers restarting, had multiple replacements but it's never fixed it, but normally it's infrequent (once a month at most) so I've just ignored it.

However today I've had the router inexplicably restart at least FIVE times today, as you can hopefully see in the Broadband Quality Monitor graph here.

It even happened again while trying to post this message (and make that twice while editing the post)!

What is it that causes the router to restart like this? There's nothing in the logs that points to any particular issue at the same times, so I don't know if it's power loss or what. I've already tried plugging it into a different mains socket connected using a different extension block to see if it was that that was the problem, though no other devices on the previous block/socket are restarting or losing power or such. Unfortunately I don't have a UPS I can move to the router's location to completely eliminate power as a cause, but if it was suffering power loss would it say so in the log? It's really not very helpful.

Is there anything I can do to stop this? Because like I say; I've tried multiple times to get support in the past and it's never been resolved, now it's worse than ever and not long after I've been told my bills are going up yet again, so I really am at the point where either it needs to get fixed or I'll be forced to switch providers.

Here are the Downstream/Upstream stats in case they are useful:

Downstream bonded channels

Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) SNR (dB) Modulation Channel ID

1	331000000	1.2	40	256 qam	25
2	339000000	1.5	40	256 qam	26
3	347000000	0.2	40	256 qam	27
4	355000000	0.5	38	256 qam	28
5	363000000	0.5	40	256 qam	29
6	371000000	0	38	256 qam	30
7	379000000	-1	38	256 qam	31
8	387000000	-0.4	38	256 qam	32
9	395000000	0	40	256 qam	33
10	403000000	-0.5	40	256 qam	34
11	411000000	-0.7	40	256 qam	35
12	419000000	-0.2	40	256 qam	36
13	427000000	-0.7	40	256 qam	37
14	435000000	-2	38	256 qam	38
15	443000000	-2	38	256 qam	39
16	451000000	-1.5	38	256 qam	40
17	459000000	-2.4	38	256 qam	41
18	467000000	-3	38	256 qam	42
19	475000000	-2	40	256 qam	43
20	483000000	-1.7	40	256 qam	44
21	491000000	-2.7	38	256 qam	45
22	499000000	-2.9	38	256 qam	46
23	507000000	-1.9	38	256 qam	47
24	515000000	-2.5	38	256 qam	48

Downstream bonded channels

Channel Locked Status RxMER (dB) Pre RS Errors Post RS Errors

1	Locked	40.9	3	0
2	Locked	40.3	0	0
3	Locked	40.3	0	0
4	Locked	38.9	4	0
5	Locked	40.3	3	0
6	Locked	38.9	6	0
7	Locked	38.9	6	0
8	Locked	38.6	6	0
9	Locked	40.3	5	0
10	Locked	40.9	0	0
11	Locked	40.3	0	0
12	Locked	40.3	6	0
13	Locked	40.3	5	0
14	Locked	38.9	0	0
15	Locked	38.9	5	0
16	Locked	38.6	13	0
17	Locked	38.6	4	0
18	Locked	38.9	0	0
19	Locked	40.3	5	0
20	Locked	40.3	5	0
21	Locked	38.9	0	0
22	Locked	38.6	0	0
23	Locked	38.9	17	0
24	Locked	38.9	6	0

Upstream bonded channels

Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) Symbol Rate (ksps) Modulation Channel ID

1	39399988	41.5	5120	64 qam	4
2	32600019	41.5	5120	64 qam	5
3	46199974	41.5	5120	64 qam	3
4	53699996	43	5120	64 qam	2

Upstream bonded channels

Channel Channel Type T1 Timeouts T2 Timeouts T3 Timeouts T4 Timeouts

1	ATDMA	0	0	0	0
2	ATDMA	0	0	0	0
3	ATDMA	0	0	0	0
4	ATDMA	0	0	0	0

[jbrennand]

Thats a strange and dreadful BQM.

Are you in modem mode with your own router by any chance

Lets see the Hub stats - can you do this.
_________________________

In your browser’s URL box type in http://192.168.0.1 (or http://192.168.100.1 - if in modem mode) (DONT click these links) - and hit return. On the first page up dont login (unless its a Hub4) just click on the “router status” icon/text at bottom-middle (Hub3) or top/right (SH’s) of the Login page and then just copy/paste the normal “Formatted Text” (not images) 3 FULL sets of data onto here – 2 tables from the Downstream, 2 from the Upstream, & the Network Logs page. Don't worry too much about the formatting it can be easily read & DON’T include personal data or MAC addresses - blank them out - if you copy/paste the data, the board software will do this for you (you may need to click the "submit" button again. If character limits are “exceeded” - just do two posts

[Haravikk]

I updated my first post with the stats I think you're after (I got disconnected again while doing it or I might have had them there before you replied), there's also a link to a more recent copy of the graph.

I'm running in router mode as I no longer have a separate wireless/ethernet router after my old one died, and I would expect a router to be able to function as one?

[jbrennand · Accepted solution]

OK... All those stats are spot on - BQM isnt !  It has a whiff of the "overutilisation" issue that can plague some users ... sometimes for years 😳

So.....

Have you checked first for any “known network faults”

As well as trying the “check service,”Area status webpage" (link at top right of this forum), also try the “free & automated” Service Status number - 0800 561 0061 - which usually gives the most up to date info. and tells you of more local issues down to postcode level. These may not be listed on the Area Status web page (Areas are not “Geographic” they are billing areas) as that usually only covers faults affecting 1000’s of customers) so phone may give you more info, but even that wont cover problems affecting just a few customers.

If nothing shows on there, try calling it in as a fault (free on 150 VM line - or 0345 454 1111 others - national rate) and see what they say when they test your connection. If they say it’s a known fault, get a fault reference number.

Or, a VM person should pick this thread up and be able to help but it can take a few days.

[Haravikk]

Thanks!

After running the service status check again it's now showing an "intermittent signal fault" in the area so it must be that, though I'm still confused as to why the router needs to restart because of this (as it takes down the entire local network except for devices that can connect by other means).

For the occasional restarts, what is the "overutilisation" issue you're referring to? What are the causes and fixes of that, as it seems like a separate issue I might need to address. Why would it cause the router to restart?

[jbrennand]

The restarts arent usually a feature of OU - but the BQM has some features - i.e. horrible during the day and better in the wee small hours. See this for some background - but as yours is a known fault its probably not applicable.

-----------------------

See this thread re. over-utilisation and Andrew’s comments in Message 20

https://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Networking-and-WiFi/Internet-keeps-dropping-for-several-minutes...

[Steven_L]

Hey @Haravikk,

Welcome back to the community and thanks for taking the time to post.
I'm sorry to hear of the issues that you're having with your connection and sorry for the late reply to your message.

I have looked into this and cannot see any issues that would be causing the problems that you're having, how is your connection running at the moment?

Regards,

Steven_L

[Haravikk]

@Steven_L:

After the network disruption in the area it was fine for a while; the high latency spikes I think are from when I'm downloading from more than a single source (usual video game downloaders that use a peer network behind the scenes to speed them up).

But today it did it again, right in the middle of a Facebook Messenger video call with no other activity (mine was the only computer using the internet on the local network, and only for the Messenger video call).

What's most infuriating is the router giving no indication of WHY it restarts; why doesn't the log saying anything? Is it the onboard software crashing?

I've seen people recommend putting the router into modem mode but surely routers have been around long enough that they should be able to cope with moderate use? And I'm wary about buying a separate router as with no clear cause the restarts I've no guarantee that it won't just do it in modem mode anyway (as it still has the handle the same number of external connections, even if a separate router offloads the internal ones).

Here's my graph from the latest restart today near 5pm:
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/quality/share/cf592ee63b8c6c8f03c9fd3509bada6159...

Like I say, this has been an off and on problems for years, we've had multiple replacement SuperHub 3's (the first time replacing a SuperHub 2) and it still happens. Usually it's not that disruptive but when it happens in the middle of a video call it can be at least 5 minutes before I can rejoin again.

[Andrew-G]

There was mention earlier of over-utilisation but I'm not seeing any sign of that in the BQMs posted.  Over-utilisation has a very distinctive trace, and that's not obvious on yours.  In terms of the stats, the hub's power levels are very steeply sloped and result in a power level range of 4.5 dBmV, whether that's material I can't say, but observation shows that (in practice, regardless of theory) problems seem to start when the downstream power range exceeds 4 dBmV.  What's causing this I can't say, but a possible culprit is a poorly setup amplifier at the cabinet, and the curious almost rectangular blocks of yellow on the BQM also make me suspect something of that nature.

Suggestion for the forum staff: Can this be escalated to the AFM with a request to assign a DOCSIS guru?  If the remote tools you use say there's nothing wrong with the hub's status, then those tools are clearly missing something. 

[Kath_F]

Hi Haravikk, 

Thanks for coming back to us on this one. 

I've had a look at the systems and all the power and signal levels are all within the optimal range so we're not able to book a visit. 

I have sent the levels over to the Area Manager to see what they make of them though. Can you please share your live URL link for your Think Broadband graph too so I can add this? 

Many thanks,