V6 recorded programme unavailable

[AnotherUser]

Hi,

I have some old BBC recordings on my V6 box, but when I try to play them, I get the message:

No Longer Available

We're sorry, but this recording can't be viewed because BBC ONE is no longer available from Virgin Media.

What's going on? Of course BBC ONE is available! If I the try to watch the same recording through my TIVO box, I get the message:

Not Permitted

Doctor Who - Flux: The Halloween Apocalypse

Due to policy set by the copyright holder, this recording cannot be played on the TIVO box.

Why a different message?

[japitts]

The time limit on recordings in these circumstances, has been imposed in full knowledge of the implications. There is not infinite space within the EPG database to retain the metadata on every discontinued channel. Therefore generous limits are imposed to allow recordings to be accessed after channel closures.

Ultimately if you want to retain copies of programmes long-term, you should purchase a DVD of it - or on FTA channels, use a DVD-recorder. VM is a subscription pay-TV service, and the use of recordings is part of that subscription.

[CPCP]

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@japitts wrote:

Therefore generous limits are imposed to allow recordings to be accessed after channel closures.

1. Are customers told anywhere that there is any kind of limit or told when the clock starts ticking?

2. The issue I raised is about recordings from BBCFourHD which is a channel that hasn't been closed.

If VM are offering the facility to record 100hrs of HD (500? hours of SD ) it is perfectly reasonable for the customer to expect to be able to keep something to watch a year after it was recorded.

[nodrogd]

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@CPCP wrote:

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@japitts wrote:

Therefore generous limits are imposed to allow recordings to be accessed after channel closures.

1. Are customers told anywhere that there is any kind of limit or told when the clock starts ticking?

2. The issue I raised is about recordings from BBCFourHD which is a channel that hasn't been closed.

If VM are offering the facility to record 100hrs of HD (500? hours of SD ) it is perfectly reasonable for the customer to expect to be able to keep something to watch a year after it was recorded.

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Most of this is covered in VMs terms & conditions Section B, subsections 2 & 8

https://www.virginmedia.com/legal/fibre-optic-services-terms-conditions

[Roger_Gooner]

The bottom line is that any recording can disappear at any time.

[AnotherUser]

I'm not sure that subsection 2 is specifically to do with recordings, but with providing access to channels etc..

However, subsection 8 says "By viewing the television service you acknowledge that the equipment we provide to you may be enabled by us to make recordings, on your behalf, of broadcasts of the types of programmes that match your preferences, for the purpose of enabling those broadcasts to be viewed at a more convenient time for you.". I can't find anywhere that indicates time limits or whatever; the "at a more convenient time for you" suggests that I could keep the recordings indefinitely...

[CPCP]

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@nodrogd wrote:

Most of this is covered in VMs terms & conditions Section B, subsections 2 & 8

Indeed, I suppose I'd have to admit that subsection 2 is a nice catch-all saying VM can basically do whatever they want. However, it most certainly isn't clear to the customer that if they've recorded something then that recording can simply become unavailable to view for no apparent reason. I would draw a distinction between the strict legal terms and conditions that VM may need to have their backs covered and treating the customers reasonably telling them what service they can expect. In any case you have to do a lot of reading in to subsection 2 to make it about recordings. As for subsection 8 a reasonable reading of 'convenient to you' doesn't suggest the recording will disappear!

[CPCP]

Furthermore, if this is something that has been made clear to the customer why do the faults team keep on insisting on sending out an engineer to fix the problem?

[Roger_Gooner]

You are talking to people who think that your box is faulty, but it's working fine. Recordings can disappear for a variety of reasons at any time, and VM has never given any guarantee on how long they will last.

[CPCP]

"You are talking to people who think that your box is faulty, but it's working fine."

Indeed, as I said myself in an earlier post. The question is, though, once I've explained the issue to them why do they think the box is faulty? If it is reasonable for the customer to be expected to know that any recordings can disappear at any time then it is reasonable to expect the faults team to know that. Or to put it another way, since it isn't obvious to the faults team then it certainly isn't reasonable to expect the customer to know.

"VM has never given any guarantee on how long they will last."

Not giving a guarantee on how long they will last is not the same thing as making it clear that they can/will disappear.

[japitts]

To an extent, the faults CS script very likely says to book a tech visit if there's no obvious cause for a reported fault.

And without having full knowledge of their systems, offshore support agents in any service provider are - I suspect - hampered by not having first hand experience of the product they're supporting. This forum is the polar opposite of that.

I think you'll struggle to argue that 12months is not providing opportunity to view recordings at a more convenient time.