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koenfucius
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Accessing content on old TiVo

I need some information about how I can retain access to the content on a TiVo after an (unexpected, and unasked for) upgrade to a Virgin 6 box. Any help welcome and received with gratitude!

The background: last week, when I called regarding an issue with my Broadband (the Hub 3 had died), I was sold an upgrade to Volt from whatever plan I was on for many years. The agent only mentioned the improvement of the broadband service, and at no time hinted at the fact that this would also involve an upgrade from TiVo to a Virgin 6 set top box.

When the parcel arrived, I was surprised to find not just the hub, but also a Virgin 6 box. I installed and activated the new modem (having been without internet for nearly a week), but in the evening I noticed the TiVo had been deactivated. I chatted with an agent about it who was not very helpful, and who kept repeating the party line - TiVo no longer supported, just plug in the Virgin box and that's that.

My mood: I am pretty hacked off that there are tens of hours of content still on the TiVo, and that there seems to be no upgrade path from one box to the next without losing all the recorded content.

My query: Now, the TiVo is still plugged in, and now has access to just a few channels - Channel 4, Channel 5 and ITV 3 it seems, plus several BBC radio channels. I also still seem to be able to access the recorded content. 

If I now unplug the TiVo and install the Virgin6 box, will I lose all the content forever? In other words, is the only way I will retain access to the content on the Tivo leaving it plugged in and forego access to the TV channel, and the ability to record? Or can I swap between the two boxes, depending on whether I want to see current or new content, or old recorded content on the TiVo?

Many thanks for any information or help!

Koen Smets

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nodrogd
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo

You will have about a week or so to view the content on your TiVO. DO NOT activate the V6 box or it will wipe your TiVO off the system. These boxes periodically check to see if they are on a valid account. If they are not they will deactivate completely. This will happen in a week or so regardless. The same happens if they cannot access VM systems after a specified period, so not attaching it to the coax after activation of the V6 will eventually have the same effect.

The long & the short of it is that your old obselete TiVO has been replaced by the V6.

Recordings on VM equipment are licenced for temporary "timeshift" purposes only. The broadcasters won't have it any other way. So when a box is removed from your account you lose everything on it regardless.

The only thing (as is usual with CS) is that they should have warned you to view any content on the old TiVO brefore you activate the new one.

VM BB TV Landline. Vonage 2nd line. Freeview/Freesat HD, ASDA/Tesco PAYG Mobile. Customer since 1993

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koenfucius
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo

Many thanks! Much appreciated.

It is the bad news that I expected, but at least over about a week I can probably watch the most important recordings.

I might even try and copy some of the content onto another device.

I have previously copied some programmes onto DVD, but my DVD writer is broken at the moment. If anyone has suggestions for perhaps a HDD-based recorder that I can use with the TiVo, that would be most appreciated.

 

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japitts
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo


@koenfucius wrote:

I have previously copied some programmes onto DVD, but my DVD writer is broken at the moment. If anyone has suggestions for perhaps a HDD-based recorder that I can use with the TiVo, that would be most appreciated.


VM's T&Cs specifically allow recording for timeshift purposes on the same equpment as it was recorded on.

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Roger_Gooner
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo

I think that the V6 was supplied in an already activated state, which is why the TiVo is deactivated as you're allowed only one box on your account. Now the TiVo is only able to show FTA (unencrypted) content. If you can get hold of a another DVD recorder with a SCART socket you can copy programmes over from the TiVo. Note that all boxes after the TiVo lack a SCART socket, and no Pay TV provider is now allowed to supply this facility.

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asim18
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo

Doesn't the UK's TV licence allow you to record any broadcast you are watching & recieving for your personal use?

I was under the impression that just because the TiVo box has terrible recording functionality, doesn't mean you can't hook up your own recorder between the TiVo and your TV, just like a VHS. I thought it's still perfectly legal to use VHS recorders to record whatever you're watching on TV? no?

In fact ALL channels on my TiVo package are completely FREE TO AIR channels. They are available for 100% free and unlimited personal recording using any device you like via satellite or terrestrial. So I'm basically paying extra TiVo monthly fee for the privilege of not being able to keep my recordings until I die? That doesn't make any sense.

Get a cheap £20 FTA DVB-T or DVB-S reciever and you can record whatever you recieving in whatever file format you want as long as you pay the TV licence. Can also get HDMI recorders too.

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Roger_Gooner
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo

It's absolutely fine to copy recordings from a TiVo to a VCR or a DVD recorder via the SCART socket, it's just that later boxes no longer have this socket (and thus effectively stops people from making copies).

You are wrong in believing that all your channels are FTA as VM encrypts almost all linear channels (and all VOD), and it requires an activated box to carry out decryption. When the box isn't activated the virtual smart card cannot do decryption, which is why the OP can view only a handful of FTA channels.

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asim18
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo

You're right, VM encrypts pretty much all their channels, even the FTA ones which are available unencrypted over satellite and terrestrial.

Just to clarify, my point was that all my channels on the lowest TiVo package are available FTA and with unrestricted recording on other platforms such as DVB-S & T. I didn't mean VM broadcasts FTA on their DVB-C.

Also getting rid of the scart socket doesn't really end all recording in its tracks does it? We've simply moved on to HDMI recorders, no?
Plugging in a recording device into the scart socket is pretty much the same as plugging a recording device into the HDMI socket, in respect to what you're trying to achieve which is to record TV for future personal use. They are both acieving the same essential goal which is to record what you're watching on TV.

I cant see anywhere on the TV licencing website which mentions you're only allowed to record broadcasts via SCART.

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Roger_Gooner
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo

Copying via SCART is only for SD content and has always been permissible as far as i know, and I never had a problem. Indeed, I still have the manual for my V+ HD box made by Scientific Atlanta which describes on p16 how to copy to VCR/DVD. However, recordings via HDMI are not permitted due to HDCP. There are ways of getting around this but you should know that this isn't allowed.

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nodrogd
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Re: Accessing content on old TiVo


@asim18 wrote:

You're right, VM encrypts pretty much all their channels, even the FTA ones which are available unencrypted over satellite and terrestrial.

Just to clarify, my point was that all my channels on the lowest TiVo package are available FTA and with unrestricted recording on other platforms such as DVB-S & T. I didn't mean VM broadcasts FTA on their DVB-C.

Also getting rid of the scart socket doesn't really end all recording in its tracks does it? We've simply moved on to HDMI recorders, no?
Plugging in a recording device into the scart socket is pretty much the same as plugging a recording device into the HDMI socket, in respect to what you're trying to achieve which is to record TV for future personal use. They are both acieving the same essential goal which is to record what you're watching on TV.

I cant see anywhere on the TV licencing website which mentions you're only allowed to record broadcasts via SCART.


The thing with VM is it is a closed system. You cease paying for the box, you lose the functionality. You have moved to a V6 so are now renting that. You no longer rent the TiVO so are not paying for it, hence can no longer access what is on it. The same goes for Sky+. Unless you pay a subscription to Sky you have no recording facility.

You will not find any recorders with an HDMI input. HDMI is protected by HDCP encryption (again at the insistence of the TV industry), whereby the unit supplying the signal must handshake with the device it connects to before it will release the decryption codes. If it detects what it is connected to is not a TV, all you get is a blank screen. This includes some format converters & splitters that people would use to copy material.

So you could buy an HDMI to SCART converter, but there is no guarantee it would work.

There is nothing in TV licensing about copying, but VM has licences from the broadcasters/programme owners that stipulate what VM are allowed to do. Take the new V360 Horizon TV platform boxes & the Steam box that VM are now renting out. These have the capability of cloud recording & don’t really need hard drives. But on the insistence of the broadcasters here in the UK they are not allowed to use the facility, which is now in use in most if the rest of Europe.

VM BB TV Landline. Vonage 2nd line. Freeview/Freesat HD, ASDA/Tesco PAYG Mobile. Customer since 1993

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