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igazz
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Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave


I am looking for help with a Virgin Media connection issue I have.
I have been with Virgin Media continuously since Telewest/Blueyonder but will need to leave in the coming days if I cannot fix this issue. I intended to upgrade to a Virgin Business package but I am reluctant while I have the current problem.

I have tried phone support twice but after struggling to get through 1st line support and then put on hold waiting for 2nd line support, I was cut off twice, both times after 2 hours on the phone.

We have a 100Mb service with a Superhub 3.
Speedtest.net speed is 100Mb-106Mb
I can download at around 12MBYTE/s which is right for a 100mbit connection (using a Lan cable to rule out WiFi issues).

However, my wife needs to download daily from her US employeyers FTP site.
When she tries, the file downloads at around 80Kbytes/s which is less than 120th of the speed she should be getting. A 1GB file which should take less than 90 seconds is taking 5 hours !!!

The strange think is, it only happens when we are using Virgin Media...

I can simultaneously connect to another Test FTP site (Filezilla) and download a 1GB file in just over a minute at 12MB/s and download another 1GB file from a test web site via a browser which also downloads in just over a minute at around 12MB/s. Meanwhile my FTP download from my wifes US employers site is at 80Kb/s with an estimated five hour download time!

I have spoke with my wifes empoyers support team who say it is not a problem with their server and my wifes UK colleagues do not have the same problem.
The problem seems to be with any Virgin Media connection. If she takes the same laptop to a friends with 30Mb Sky connection, the same file downloads in a few minutes, over a WiFi connection. If she then takes her Laptop to our daughters and connects to her 100Mb Virgin Media Broadband, the same file downloads at 80Kb/s and would take hours.

I have a trace route using our Virgin Broadband from her Laptop and also from the Superhubs internal traceroute and a traceroute using the Sky Broadband which I will include below.

I have also tried the Superhub in Modem Mode connected to a new Netgear router using factory settings but the slow downloads remained.

I thought it may be a problem with the Cisco Anyconnect VPN but I also get the same very slow download speed when downloading from the their sharepoint service housed on the same server and that doesnt require a VPN connection.

 

I think it may be a routing/Port forwarding problem but cannot get through to Virgin Media support to get help.

Anyone have any suggestions before I leave, Please?

=====================================================

Traceroutes below -

I have done many (3 below), often they complete to final destination ok but sometimes, including the traceroute from the SuperHubs internal Traceroute, it doesn't complete the final destination.
The Traceroute did seem 'simpler' when using Sky broadband.

 

C:\Windows\system32>tracert 208.118.112.122

Tracing route to h208-118-112-122.bigpipeinc.com [208.118.112.122]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 2 ms 1 ms 3 ms 192.168.0.1
2 12 ms 14 ms 9 ms 10.53.39.1
3 12 ms 13 ms 13 ms pres-core-2b-xe-702-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.252.42.93]
4 * * * Request timed out.
5 21 ms 22 ms 17 ms 86.85-254-62.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk [62.254.85.86]
6 * * * Request timed out.
7 109 ms 111 ms 109 ms us-nyc01b-rd2-ae-9-0.aorta.net [84.116.140.170]
8 112 ms 111 ms 110 ms us-was03a-ri1-ae-10-0.aorta.net [84.116.130.174]
9 113 ms 113 ms 110 ms 4.68.39.141
10 * * * Request timed out.
11 135 ms 136 ms 131 ms 4.14.14.98
12 131 ms 132 ms 131 ms rc4ec-be6-1.il.shawcable.net [66.163.65.70]
13 148 ms 147 ms * rc3sc-be25-1.wp.shawcable.net [66.163.75.133]
14 * * * Request timed out.
15 149 ms 148 ms 152 ms h208-118-112-122.bigpipeinc.com [208.118.112.122]

Trace complete.
====================================

SuperHub Diagnostic Traceroute

Superhub Tracerout

Trace Statistics : traceroute to 208.118.112.122 (208.118.112.122), 30 hops max, 38 byte packets
1 10.53.39.1 (10.53.39.1) 0.000 ms 0.000 ms 0.000 ms
2 pres-core-2b-xe-10117-0.network.virginmedia.net (80.0.160.113) 10.000 ms 10.000 ms 10.000 ms
3 * * *
4 86.85-254-62.static.virginmediabusiness.co.uk (62.254.85.86) 10.000 ms 10.000 ms 10.000 ms
5 * * *
6 us-nyc01b-rd2-ae-9-0.aorta.net (84.116.140.170) 100.000 ms 80.000 ms 80.000 ms
7 us-was03a-ri1-ae-10-0.aorta.net (84.116.130.174) 90.000 ms 100.000 ms 90.000 ms
8 4.68.39.141 (4.68.39.141) 90.000 ms 90.000 ms 90.000 ms
9 * * *
10 4.14.14.98 (4.14.14.98) 110.000 ms 110.000 ms 110.000 ms
11 rc4ec-be6-1.il.shawcable.net (66.163.65.70) 110.000 ms * 100.000 ms
12 rc3sc-be25-1.wp.shawcable.net (66.163.75.133) 280.000 ms * 130.000 ms
13 * * *
14 * * *
15 * * *
16 * * *
17 * * *
18 * * *
19 * * *
20 * * *
21 * * *
22 * * *
23 * * *
24 * * *
25 * * *

===========================================

The 'simpler' SKY traceroute image below

Traceroute using Sky BroadbandTraceroute using Sky Broadband

=============================================

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igazz
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave

Router Status
===========

Downstream bonded channels

Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) SNR (dB) Modulation Channel ID
1 299000000 6.5 40 256 qam 21
2 139000000 8.4 38 256 qam 1
3 147000000 8.5 38 256 qam 2
4 155000000 8.8 40 256 qam 3
5 163000000 8.5 40 256 qam 4
6 171000000 8.5 40 256 qam 5
7 179000000 8 40 256 qam 6
8 187000000 8 40 256 qam 7
9 195000000 7.5 40 256 qam 8
10 203000000 7.3 40 256 qam 9
11 211000000 7.1 38 256 qam 10
12 219000000 7.3 40 256 qam 11
13 227000000 7 40 256 qam 12
14 235000000 6.9 40 256 qam 13
15 243000000 6.4 40 256 qam 14
16 251000000 6.3 40 256 qam 15
17 259000000 5.9 38 256 qam 16
18 267000000 6.1 40 256 qam 17
19 275000000 5.6 38 256 qam 18
20 283000000 6.1 40 256 qam 19
21 291000000 5.6 40 256 qam 20
22 307000000 5.9 40 256 qam 22
23 315000000 6.5 40 256 qam 23
24 323000000 6 40 256 qam 24

 

Upstream bonded channels

Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) Symbol Rate (ksps) Modulation Channel ID
1 60300000 41.3 5120 64 qam 1
2 39400000 38.8 5120 64 qam 4
3 46200002 39.8 5120 64 qam 3
4 53700004 41.3 5120 64 qam 2

Upstream bonded channels

Channel Channel Type T1 Timeouts T2 Timeouts T3 Timeouts T4 Timeouts
1 ATDMA 0 0 0 0
2 ATDMA 0 0 1 0
3 ATDMA 0 0 0 0
4 ATDMA 0 0 1 0


Network Log

Time Priority Description

20/12/2020 22:00:30 notice LAN login Success;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
20/12/2020 08:00:2 notice DHCP Renew - lease parameters tftp file-cmreg-vmdg505-bbt057-b.cm modified;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
20/12/2020 08:00:2 Error DHCP RENEW WARNING - Field invalid in response v4 option;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
17/12/2020 23:50:32 critical No Ranging Response received - T3 time-out;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
16/12/2020 23:59:16 notice LAN login Success;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
16/12/2020 04:09:59 Warning! RCS Partial Service;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
16/12/2020 04:03:31 notice LAN login Success;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
16/12/2020 03:58:27 Warning! RCS Partial Service;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
16/12/2020 03:54:20 notice LAN login Success;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
16/12/2020 01:35:51 Warning! RCS Partial Service;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
16/12/2020 01:00:46 notice LAN login Success;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
15/12/2020 03:52:35 critical No Ranging Response received - T3 time-out;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
14/12/2020 16:26:15 notice LAN login Success;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
12/12/2020 13:53:33 notice DHCP Renew - lease parameters tftp file-cmreg-vmdg505-bbt057-b.cm modified;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
12/12/2020 13:53:33 Error DHCP RENEW WARNING - Field invalid in response v4 option;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
09/12/2020 17:46:12 critical No Ranging Response received - T3 time-out;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
09/12/2020 14:24:28 notice LAN login Success;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
09/12/2020 13:38:36 critical No Ranging Response received - T3 time-out;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
09/12/2020 01:53:32 notice DHCP Renew - lease parameters tftp file-cmreg-vmdg505-bbt057-b.cm modified;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;
09/12/2020 01:53:32 Error DHCP RENEW WARNING - Field invalid in response v4 option;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.0;

 

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igazz
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave

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tehwolf
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave

Unlikely you're gonna get anywhere with this - your connection is running at full speed, including when you're using the same service with a different server - as proven by the ftp tests you're getting from Filezilla. 

this is all speculation ofcourse, since i have no idea what's going on on the VM network (or any other 3rd party networks for that matter) but it's possible that there's a capacity issue somewhere between (e.g.) virgin media and level3 (i.e. they only have a 10gb link but are trying to pass significantly more traffic than that..) or it could be a simple misconfiguration somewhere along the line that no one has noticed yet, but when they do it will be magically resolved.. 

looks like virgin doesn't peer directly with shaw cable - since your connection is transiting through the level3 network (same on sky for that matter).. 

If it's a capacity issue, unless their network planning teams agree that they need to upgrade their current 10gb link to a 40gb or 100gb link, it's unlikely to improve any time soon.

whatever the issue, you're up in the realms of how big networks connect together and getting someone to look at it (who a. actually cares, and b. is in a position to do anything about it) i would rate as slim to none. 

igazz
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave

Hi, thanks for your reply.

Oh no, that does not sound good. I was hoping to stay with VM as they are by far the fastest service to my home.

I was hoping to go to VM business to resolve the issue through better support but I guess they will use the same backbone/route so I would be in the same situation.

Maybe I could get a another Broadband supplier and combine them (Load balancing router?) to give me faster VM speed with normal browsing, conferencing, downloading but my wife's Canadian FTP download would use the new service provider.. but how would her laptop/Filezilla know to use that provider or, would it not matter, the fastest route would win? I'm obviously out of my depth now.
Option 2 would be to get a new provider (only 30Mb) just for her office/Laptop and stick with VM for the rest of the household?

1. Is there any Network Analysis software available to me that would help confirm/locate the bottleneck? MTR?
(I am guessing that the bottleneck is with one of the 'Timed out' pings but not necessarily) 

2. Are there any other solutions out there in Networking world... VPN, tunnelling, leased line, laying my own cable? 

3. I would be grateful if you could give me a quick 'dumbed down' explanation of   "looks like virgin doesn't peer directly with shaw cable - since your connection is transiting through the level3 network (same on sky for that matter).." 

Thanks

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tehwolf
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave


@igazz wrote:

Hi, thanks for your reply.

Oh no, that does not sound good. I was hoping to stay with VM as they are by far the fastest service to my home.

I was hoping to go to VM business to resolve the issue through better support but I guess they will use the same backbone/route so I would be in the same situation.


It's likely that VMB will have the same issue - though as i said in my first post - my initial response is full of assumptions (largely based on the fact that you have the same experience on another users virgin media circuit), but if it is the cause of the issue, then it's likely to affect all VM traffic.


@igazz wrote:

Maybe I could get a another Broadband supplier and combine them (Load balancing router?) to give me faster VM speed with normal browsing, conferencing, downloading but my wife's Canadian FTP download would use the new service provider.. but how would her laptop/Filezilla know to use that provider or, would it not matter, the fastest route would win? I'm obviously out of my depth now.
Option 2 would be to get a new provider (only 30Mb) just for her office/Laptop and stick with VM for the rest of the household?


It is possible to engineer traffic to use particular connections, but you're getting into more complex networking than you're probably wanting to.. e.g. i have a couple of connections at home and send 99% of my traffic down my VM connection but traffic to a handful of destinations down the other link.. 


@igazz wrote:

1. Is there any Network Analysis software available to me that would help confirm/locate the bottleneck? MTR?
(I am guessing that the bottleneck is with one of the 'Timed out' pings but not necessarily) 

MTR isn't going to help - you're probably not going to be able to work out where the issue is, and even if you could, you have no way of influencing change at those chokepoints (again, we're assuming that my assertion of an oversubscribed link is the root cause here...). The "timed out" pings are a red herring - that's a configurable option on the device - the service provider is choosing not to respond to ICMP requests - doesn't mean the device is having an issue.. 


@igazz wrote:

2. Are there any other solutions out there in Networking world... VPN, tunnelling, leased line, laying my own cable? 


You could absolutely try a VPN and see if this improves things - is VPN software something that your wife's IT department would be happy with her installing on her (presumably) work provided laptop?  If not, you could do it on your router, but again, you're venturing into more complex networking - you may or may not want to do this..

Leased lines are relatively expensive compared to consumer broadband, you're probably better off just getting an adsl connection from BT/Sky/whoever for your wife to use for work..

As for laying your own cable.. from where to where? 😄


@igazz wrote:

3. I would be grateful if you could give me a quick 'dumbed down' explanation of   "looks like virgin doesn't peer directly with shaw cable - since your connection is transiting through the level3 network (same on sky for that matter).." 


Big network providers "peer" with each other - this is essentially a fancy way of saying that they put a cable between a piece of equipment owned by provider_A and a piece of equipment owned by provider_B and pass each other's traffic.  This reduces their cost, as they are able to get traffic between their networks without paying Provider_C for "transit" connectivity. As Liberty Global (VM Parent company) largely provides connectivity to households, it is interested in peering with companies that it exchanges a lot of traffic with - think Amazon, Google, Facebook, Twitter, Netflix etc. but it is less interested in peering with other companies that provide connectivity to end users, since they probably don't exchange enough traffic to make it economically viable.. this is why when you traceroute to the server in question, your traffic leaves the VM network (aorta.net) and then goes via Level3's network before reaching Shaw's network.. 

igazz
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave

My wife does already use a VPN connection to her employers FTP server but not to access their web/sharepoint services which I believe are on the same server or at least at the same location and the poor download speeds persist with both services, so with or without using the VPN.
I am wondering if a different VPN provider might use a 'different route' which would bypass my chokepoint. I will try to gather some info with a bit of googling or maybe a VPN forum.

I am reluctant to give up my (normally) fast VM Broadband and so if the VPN routing option doesn't work out then I will probably get a second Broadband service installed. Either standalone to the office or investigate load balancing routers. I like the idea of a second supplier for redundancy.

Thanks for your informative 'Peering... level3... etc' explanation

I still haven't ruled out laying my own cable from our office over to Winnipeg... how hard can it be 😉  

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treacle
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Message 8 of 9
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave

Did you ever get this resolved? Sounds a little like an issue I'm facing now....

https://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Networking-and-WiFi/Can-t-connect-to-Webex-and-any-of-their-sit...
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igazz
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Message 9 of 9
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Re: Very Very Slow Download only with Virgin Media (Not WiFi) About to Leave

Hi, no we are still experiencing the same very slow download speed when using Virgin to download from  her employer. She has used other internet service providers when she knows she needs to do a lot of downloading. We were going to try using a vpn to try to use a different path to her employer but her tech team thinks it will cause security issues logging in. 

Sorry but I am unable to follow your link, I think it has been cut short.

Gary

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