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mpitts
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Message 291 of 297
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Re: How soon can we upgrade to Gigabit/Gigabit speeds over DOCSIS 3.1? #Gigaworld #ProjectLightning

It really won't I'm afraid, not for a long, long time!”

Depends what your metric is.

If the target is say 95% population coverage, my money is definitely on 5G getting there before Hyperoptic or VM.

(Obviously Vodafone will be FTTP AND 5G, so presumably in the strongest position.)

 

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Superuser
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Message 292 of 297
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Re: How soon can we upgrade to Gigabit/Gigabit speeds over DOCSIS 3.1? #Gigaworld #ProjectLightning


@mpitts wrote:

It really won't I'm afraid, not for a long, long time!”

Depends what your metric is.

If the target is say 95% population coverage, my money is definitely on 5G getting there before Hyperoptic or VM.

(Obviously Vodafone will be FTTP AND 5G, so presumably in the strongest position.)

 


The big problem (often glossed over) is that 5G despite the higher bandwidth and low latency, has appallingly bad range and especially low ability to penetrate walls and other solid objects - you need a lot of them to cover the same area as a 4G or 3G signal  can from a single mast.

For outdoor, mobile use, the providers would literally need to fit small transmitters every couple of hundred metres or so, and each of these would need power and (more importantly) a fibre backhaul connection. So if you have to roll out a large number of transmitters each with fibre, it's not that big a jump to simply fibre all the properties in the area anyway.

Even if you were to have a close-by transmitter, the signal almost certainly won't penetrate into your house through the outside walls, it'll struggle to even get through an interior wall. The only way to do it would be to have a small receiving antenna on your outside wall, with line-of-sight to the nearest 5G transmitter, even then everyone connected to this transmitter would be sharing a 10 Gbit/s backhaul, so forget hundreds or even dozens of users all connected to a single 5G transmitter all getting symmetric gigabit links, 100/100 Meg is much more likely, still quicker than the vast majority of people can currently get, but nothing like the 5G hype would have it.

Oddly enough (or maybe not) 5G is more likely to be a viable alternative to fixed line broadband in sparsely populated rural areas where the lack of buildings might help with the range issue - I can see one or two strategically placed 5G transmitters being able to cover, say, a small rural village.

I just don't see it being a workable alternative to FTTP in many urban areas.

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mossman
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Message 293 of 297
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Re: How soon can we upgrade to Gigabit/Gigabit speeds over DOCSIS 3.1? #Gigaworld #ProjectLightning

That's why the mobile companies are looking at existing street furniture for 5G transmitters.

It's going to be a big infrastructure build and of course they will pick the low-hanging fruit first.

 

And that's even before we look at getting existing low data caps increased or even removed.

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mpitts
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Message 294 of 297
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Re: How soon can we upgrade to Gigabit/Gigabit speeds over DOCSIS 3.1? #Gigaworld #ProjectLightning

I thought the 5G protocol was frequency agnostic. Lower frequencies can be used for greater range and wall penetration, higher frequencies for greater bandwidth. Devices can be made to switch accordingly. 

What the initial implementations over the next few years will consist of though I don’t know.

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cje85
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Message 295 of 297
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Re: How soon can we upgrade to Gigabit/Gigabit speeds over DOCSIS 3.1? #Gigaworld #ProjectLightning


@mpitts wrote:

I thought the 5G protocol was frequency agnostic. Lower frequencies can be used for greater range and wall penetration, higher frequencies for greater bandwidth. Devices can be made to switch accordingly. 


That's correct. 5G will use a variety of frequencies. 700/800Mhz will be used for rural and indoor coverage, the higher frequencies like 2300/3400Mhz will provide more capacity for towns/cities but don't penetrate very far through buildings.  

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Superuser
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Message 296 of 297
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Re: How soon can we upgrade to Gigabit/Gigabit speeds over DOCSIS 3.1? #Gigaworld #ProjectLightning


@cje85 wrote:

@mpitts wrote:

I thought the 5G protocol was frequency agnostic. Lower frequencies can be used for greater range and wall penetration, higher frequencies for greater bandwidth. Devices can be made to switch accordingly. 


That's correct. 5G will use a variety of frequencies. 700/800Mhz will be used for rural and indoor coverage, the higher frequencies like 2300/3400Mhz will provide more capacity for towns/cities but don't penetrate very far through buildings.  


All true except that at 750 Mhz the maximum data transfer rates will be no better than 4G at it's best, the sub 6GHz bands might well push data at up to 400-500 Mbit/s so that'll be the middle tier - latency should be less so the gamers aught to be happier. You can only get the 'promised' gigabit speed by using the much higher millimetre waves at 26-28 GHz which have virtually no penetrating power at all and don't even appear to have been licensed for use in Europe anyway.

There's a huge amount of hyper over 5G, what I suspect will happen is that we'll see the low and mid frequency variants deployed with much fanfare as being '5G technology' (which will be true) but anyone expecting to get blazingly fast internet access via it will be sadly disappointed.

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Roger_Gooner
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Message 297 of 297
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Re: How soon can we upgrade to Gigabit/Gigabit speeds over DOCSIS 3.1? #Gigaworld #ProjectLightning

Operators will use the frequency bands permitted by Ofcom, which has identified the following:

  • 700Mhz (for wide area coverage)
  • 3.4-3.8Ghz (for high number of connected devices at high speeds)
  • 26GHz (for ultra-high capacity but very low coverage)

A year ago Ofcom auctioned off 3.4Ghz spectrum to all four operators.

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