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Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds

Hi,

My postcode is eligible for 1gig plan, however, the upload speeds are laughable to say the least (52mbps).

Given Docsis 3.1 supports 1gig upload speeds, are there any plans to make this available anytime soon?

I used to be on hyperoptic 1gig plan, and was used to 900+mbps simultaneous up/down. Its mind boggling why Virgin is capping upload speeds?

I would love to move to 1gig plan but paying 60+ quid for 1gig download and 52mbps upload is just not good enough. Also with Wifi6 routers with .ax standard out now for residential/smb use, I am surprised why Virgin wouldn't provide simultaneous speeds for all the plans m100, 200,350 etc... as well.

Is it due to the backend still not ready to handle that kind of upload bandwidth? Any answers would be really helpful in understanding the logic.

Also, cityfibre is offering business services now in my area but waiting for residential roll out. Their main pipes are about 500 mtrs from my place.. so hoping Vodafone/Talktalk new fiber roll out covers us.....however, still not able to understand why virgin is waiting to play catchup instead of start offering that kind of speed to existing eligible areas if not everyone?

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Re: Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds

The downstream is Docsis 3.1, upload is still 3.0, Hyperoptic started their network on Docsis 3.1 so they had the equipment ready to do deploy both down and upstreams at the 3.1 level, where-as Virgin started out years ago with a network that has been slowly upgraded over the years, and the upstream on Docsis 3.0 at a Virgin customer-level would probably be unstable so they cap it to ensure it stays as stable as possible.

The entire Virgin network is scheduled to be overhauled to 3.1 by the end of 2021, it's not as simple as flicking a switch, they need to order the equipment, get it in and ensure it actually works whilst causing minimal impact on customers. Virgin play catchup because it's all they can do, TalkTalk etc started out on 3.1, Virgin didn't, there's also been no real demand so they need to work on a budget.


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I work for Virgin Media - but all opinions posted here are my own
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Re: Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds

@badhodor123 it really isn't a case of 'just playing catchup' or VM throttling uploads for some reason, the technologies used for FTTH and VM's HFC connections are completely different. DOCSIS was always good for fast downloads (rivalling fibre speeds - but using existing 'cable TV' infrastructure) but the standards specified much less available bandwidth for uploads, the frequencies used are far lower and as such just cannot carry as much data reliably.

Without going into all the details, DOCSIS 3.1 has a different way of sending the various channels down the existing cables but even then the standards give a theoretical throughput of about 10 Gb/s down and 1 Gb/s up. This all requires a lot of kit at the various headends to be upgraded (and it's not cheap) - it really isn't a case of 'just switch on faster upload speeds'

Lastly the truth of the matter is that although you might well need/want faster uploads, the vast majority of the users just concentrate on download speeds - how fast can i download this game, how quickly can I torrent this pirate movie linux disco? Fast uploads just isn't (at least right now), a big selling point.

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Re: Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds

After the entire UK network has been upgraded to DOCSIS 3.1 VM will have a platform which can be further upgraded to provide 1Gbps upload. I'm confident that we will see higher upload speeds from 2022 but it won't be anything like 1Gbps across the board. What do I mean by that? It would be a ridicuous waste of money to upgrade the entire network to provide such a high upload speed for the vast majority who won't pay for it, but VM would have the ability to split off a user, which can be a business, a college or even an individual or two, onto a network segment to deliver higher speeds.

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Re: Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds

On VM 1Gb/s only 1 Channel (total of 31) is 3.1, the other 30 are 3.0

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Re: Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds

To really increase it, they need to extend the upstream spectrum. All the actives must be upgraded (amplifiers and nodes). I have no doubt that they will do that, it just takes more time (and money) than adding downstream capacity.

Some of the other European operators that have upgraded the upstream are now offering 500 Mbps.
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Re: Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds

I believe that the current 50Mbps upload speed of Gig1 can be doubled by DOCSIS 3.1 using 3.0 frequencies (and with no amps needing replacement), but it's not a long-term solution

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Re: Docsis 3.1 and super slow upload speeds


@Aaron2 wrote:

The downstream is Docsis 3.1, upload is still 3.0, Hyperoptic started their network on Docsis 3.1 so they had the equipment ready to do deploy both down and upstreams at the 3.1 level, where-as Virgin started out years ago with a network that has been slowly upgraded over the years, and the upstream on Docsis 3.0 at a Virgin customer-level would probably be unstable so they cap it to ensure it stays as stable as possible.

 


Hyperoptic don't use DOCSIS in any way, Virgin are the only provider that do. DOCSIS is not a technology a new broadband network would choose to use, but is good for providing broadband over legacy cable TV networks.

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