Hub 4.0 - Replacement request please

[movisman]

Hi there,

I would like to request a replacement Hub 4.0 please, to replace one which is experiencing a few issues. A technician is not required - coax signal quality, speed etc, are all good and all sat within the correct thresholds. The issue is solely related to the hardware/software involving the Hub 4.0 and i'd like to try a replacement to see if it solves any of the issues i'm experiencing.

Currently I am facing several issues. I have searched the forum and one of the issues was resolved by swapping the Hub for a new one, and one is actually a bug I reported myself, which, while unlikely to be resolved by a hardware replacement (the issue appears to be firmware related), you never know as perhaps later shipments of the Hub 4.0 are newer hardware revisions.

Naturally, I have tried factory resetting the device, but unfortunately even with a full pin hole reset for 60 seconds, you cannot actually 'truly' factory reset the Hub 4.0. I know this because the DHCP table doesn't even flush and all devices will obtain the same address/lease even 'post reset'. The pinhole reset doesn't do much except reset all of the settings to default. It doesn't rewrite any firmware or put the device back to a fresh 'out of the box' state.

To summarise the issues:

1) My Logitech Harmony Hub will not connect to the 2.4ghz network, when the router is configured to run in 802.11n mode. The Harmony Hub is fully capable of 802.11n and was connecting to my previous router fine (BT Smart Hub 6), as well as the VM Hub 3 before that. If I run the Hub 4.0 2.4ghz network in mixed mode (802.11g/n) it will connect, but I do not wish to run in a legacy mode because I have no 'g' only devices on the network.

Similar issue here:
https://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Networking-and-WiFi/Hub-4-Missing-Wireless-Network/m-p/4369393#...
(message 6)

2) The odd device has trouble connecting, especially at 5ghz. Specifically, I have a Linux based device which, when observing the logs seems to experience authentication timeouts when initially connecting. It will not complete the handshake with the router. This could be authentication related, or it could related to DHCP and not being able to obtain an address in time. If I drop the device back onto 2.4ghz it will be fine. To confirm, if I connect the device to another 5ghz network, eg. neighbours router (BT), or a mobile hotspot hosted on either my laptop or mobile - it connects every time on 5ghz. It is only when connecting to the Hub 4.0 I experience problems. Sometimes it will connect, but perhaps only 20% of the time. This process of elimination leads me to believe the router is the cause of the issue here.

Possible 'similar' issue (although this is DHCP related), resolved by replacing the hardware:
https://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Networking-and-WiFi/Hub4-and-DHCP/td-p/4580574

3) Bug regarding Smart WiFi optimisation and the fact it resets any custom 2.4ghz SSID to default values when the router is rebooted - so long as WiFi optimisation is switched on. Turn off Smart WiFi optimisation and all is well. Reported to VM months ago, but no fix. Other threads on the forum confirm the same issue.

My post reporting the bug and supplying a workaround:
https://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Networking-and-WiFi/Hub-4-0-reboot-bug-resets-custom-2-4ghz-SSI...

Another example:
https://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Networking-and-WiFi/Hub-4-changing-SSID-s-back-to-default/td-p/...

Probably won't be fixed by replacing the hardware, but would be an interesting experiment.

4) A generic complaint is poor 2.4ghz performance in general (I have separated my SSID's to force as many devices onto 5ghz as possible). To clarify, my 2.4ghz sits on a non-overlapping channel which no-one else is using (channel 1), so interference is not a problem. 5ghz performance is pretty good to be fair. Range of the Hub 4.0 is also improved over previous ISP supplied devices.

Yes, I know many people on here will say 'the Hub 4.0 is a bug fest, put it in modem mode and get your own router' - but i'd like to at least explore swapping the hardware out just in case it solves some of these connectivity issues.

If not - indeed, I will have no choice but to pursue a 3rd party router and put the Hub 4.0 into modem only mode. I'm sure that will solve my issues.

Thanks!

[movisman]

Hi conman33158,

Yeah, well put to be honest. I don't have a gig connection, so an AC router would be fine for me - i'm not doing huge amounts of internal network transfers either. I have just the one WiFi 6 capable device right now, my Galaxy S10e. But i'm tied between a couple of ASUS models. I could go either AC or AX really.

I see you have an RT-AX56U, I was actually looking at this one as it's very cheap on Amazon right now (90). My concern, this one being one of the lowest in the AX range was if the range would be better than the Hub 4.0 or not, as this is one of the most important factors for me. I can just about get away with running a single router, because the Hub 4.0 in fairness does cover the house and garden on 5ghz. This router generally gets good reviews though for it's value. Any thoughts on range with this one?

The other model I looked at was an AC router, the older RT-AC86U. This one is clearly the better router, however it is a few years old now. I've also heard a lot of complaints about heat and the 2.4ghz network failing on this model, but i'm not sure whether this would affect more recent iterations manufactured in 2020/2021. The newer AX equivalent, the RT-AX86U - is a bit out of my range in terms of budget right now.

The RT-AX82U that you also have, this was on a great offer a few weeks back for Prime Day, only £135 I think it was. I should have snapped that up then!

Cheers!

[conman33158]

The RT-AX82U would indeed be the better out of the 2 but as far a wifi range they are pretty much the same. I have the whole house covered plus front and rear gardens which is all I need.

In fairness as far as wifi speed is concerned, how fast do you actually need your wifi connection to be? As most mobile devices are used for watching a few videos on Youtube, streaming and maybe Zoom/Facetime calls which ideally only uses less than 8mb anyway so you're not going to see any real world difference if I'm honest, even gaming is more about the ping time than bandwidth unless you're downloading games and to be honest if I didn't download as much I wouldn't even have a 1 gig connection either, but being a medium to heavy downloader at times it suits my needs.

I have a laptop, 2 x 4K Firesticks, 3 Echo Dots, a Tablet and an iPhone plus 5 x 2.4Ghz smart plugs on wireless and my work laptop and main PC wired and have no connection problems at all and to be honest, any time I do have problems it's usually down to Virgin as my internal network is sound 🙂

[movisman]

Hi,

Interesting that you have found the two models are similar in terms of WiFi range. Range is definitely important to me, but whatever I end up with needs to be as good as the Hub 4.0 for range if not better. This is on 5ghz - I don't use 2.4ghz at all except for the devices that require it. 2.4ghz speed on the Hub 4.0 is not great at all.

As far as WiFi speed goes, exactly and I completely agree. Even 4K streaming doesn't use huge amounts of bandwidth - we do have a few devices sometimes streaming at once, but again nothing particularly taxing. Generally we have about 15 devices connected at one time, this includes a couple of smart bulbs, a couple of smart appliances and a few Google Homes. The other devices are laptops, tablets, TV, Virgin box etc. I think the idea of going WiFi 6 is to have additional bonuses like WPA3 support, also most ASUS devices manufactured in the last couple of years are already WiFi 6 so you don't have a choice, unless you go for an older model.

The draw of the older RT-AC86U (WiFi 5) is a couple of things. According to reviews, range is excellent (although it sounds like the AX56 might already be good enough judging by your previous comment). But also it does have hardware VPN acceleration on the chipset, meaning if I want to set up a VPN client on the router it should achieve around 200mb/s and hammer the CPU. Non hardware VPN accelerated models (eg. most others) tend to cap out around 50mb/s. Merlin firmware also opens up the capabilities of choosing to have only certain devices pass through the VPN client on the router, which is very nice and opens up a lot of flexibility. It might be something I use, but again it's a "nice to have" at this point.

Overall, my main target right now is a robust, reliable router with excellent range (most important), with some advanced management features (all ASUS routers seem pretty feature rich in this regard). A USB port would be good, but again most ASUS routers already have one. I'm not worried about the rabbit hole of marketing BS boasting huge speeds on the box, where they go on about devices connecting at silly speeds, 4x4 MU-MIMO etc, etc, etc, as really none of my devices will benefit. I don't need 160mhz support, as again i'll bet only one or two of my devices support it. Nearly everything I have on the network right now is WiFi 5 AC and either 1x1 or 2x2 MIMO tops I suspect. The S10e is the most 'advanced' device I suppose, as that supports WiFi 6. So anyway, i'd be happy with either WiFi 5 or WiFi 6, because speed of the WiFi connection inside the network will be easily good enough either way. And i'm not even on a gig connection from VM so again internet speeds are a bottleneck factor in high signal areas anyway.

The only reason i'm considering a WiFi 6 router is just some of the fringe benefits like WPA3, and the fact most modern releases by ASUS are already WiFi 6. Nothing to do with speed or anything like that.

One question about the channels on 5ghz, does your ASUS allow selection of channels 149 through to 161 (band C)? Just curious.

Thanks!

[conman33158]

On the 5Ghz is has Control channel 36 to 140 and 20/40/80/160Mhz bandwidth. As for range you could always look into a decent mesh system or go for 2 routers like I did and use Asus AiMesh setup👍

[movisman]

Thanks for the info re: channels available 👍

Yes, indeed I could look at a mesh system or using two routers, but it shouldn't be necessary. The Hub 4.0 covers the area I need, so hopefully a third party router will offer the same. Signal strength offered by the antennae is restricted by law anyway I think, so you can only get so much range out of one router. I'd imagine any ASUS router should have the same reach as the Hub 4.0.

Just need to decide which one to get 😋