VM email and Outlook

[KPardoe]

I have given up on getting an answer as to why changing my VM password would fix the problems I've been having (since 19/06/23).  I have changed my password and can now access my mail via webmail.  However, I can still access email via Outlook on my phone and via a mail client on my tablet USING MY OLD PASSWORD.  I still cannot get email via Outlook on my laptop, even though I have been through every combination of POP3, IMAP and SMTP that is listed on the VM email help area.  I have even checked with the person with the main email account and they have no problem accessing emails via the web or Outlook (on any platform), in spite of having out of date details for the connection settings.  The most recent attempts to get Outlook to work on my laptop were tracked by switching on logging within Outlook and produced the following:

IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] Connecting to ’imap.virginmedia.com’ on port 993.
IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 0, asNew = 4, ae = 0
IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] Negotiating secure connection with ’Microsoft Unified Security Protocol Provider’.
IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 4, asNew = 6, ae = 2
IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 6, asNew = 6, ae = 4
IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 6, asNew = 5, ae = 2
IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 5, asNew = 5, ae = 3
IMAP: 16:23:16 [rx] * OK [CAPABILITY IMAP4rev1 AUTH=PLAIN] Virgin Media server ready.
IMAP: 16:23:16 [tx] w0ww CAPABILITY
IMAP: 16:23:16 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 5, asNew = 5, ae = 3
IMAP: 16:23:16 [rx] * CAPABILITY IMAP4rev1 AUTH=PLAIN
IMAP: 16:23:16 [rx] w0ww OK Pre-login capabilities listed, post-login capabilities have more.
IMAP: 16:23:16 [tx] LOGIN command sent
IMAP: 16:23:18 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 5, asNew = 5, ae = 3
IMAP: 16:23:18 [rx] 9qa8 NO [AUTHENTICATIONFAILED] Authentication failed.
IMAP: 16:23:18 [db] ERROR: "The server rejected your login. Verify that your username and password are correct.", hr=0x800CCCE3
IMAP: 16:23:18 [db] Connection to ’imap.virginmedia.com’ closed.
IMAP: 16:23:18 [db] OnNotify: asOld = 5, asNew = 0, ae = 5

So, what's the answer?  This was tested using my old and new passwords with exactly the same results.

[coenoby]

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@KPardoe wrote:

So, what's the answer?  This was tested using my old and new passwords with exactly the same results.

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For what it's worth, the only times I have seen Outlook report an authentication error code 0x800CCCE3  has been with email accounts such as AOL that require you to generate a specific mail app password to access your email account via an email app/client such as Outlook.

I have not previously seen it reported for a VM email account but it does make sense because VM recently introduced a Mail App password for their email accounts. (It has been mentioned many times on this forum but VM have not really publicised it to any great extent).

If you have changed the password for this email account you will definitely need to generate a Mail App Password and enter that as the password in your Outlook settings for that email account. However, you will still need to use the normal password to access the email account via VM's webmail service.

To generate a mail app password for your VM email account you need to sign into the My Virgin Media page and go to the "Accounts details" page where you can edit (reset) your password.

Scroll down from there to "Mailbox app password management." and click on "Manage".
You can then generate an app password which will be in the format:           video-post-mossy-sharp
You will then need to enter that new app password (including the "-") into the password field for that email account in your email apps such as Outlook.

If you have already been doing that I apologise for wasting your time.

Coenoby

[KPardoe]

Thank you for your comprehensive and quick reply.  However, why would I have to generate a mail app password for use on a laptop but not a phone?  Also, why would the primary account holder not have to do anything like this?  It seems crazy and confusing that it is needed for some (random) platforms or applications and not for others.

The only reason I tried changing the password for the web login was because that was the only answer I was getting from any VM directed "help".  I was reluctant to do that as I haven't had an explanation as to why I could access emails via Outlook on my phone and a mail app on my tablet but not Outlook on my laptop.  I still haven't got that answer.  Nor why my old password still works on the devices it was set up on.  I know that the Outlook for Android app is different on a phone than for a laptop, but as the primary account holder uses a desktop, I would expect he should have the same problems as I have with my laptop and Outlook (same Microsoft 365), but he doesn't.

[coenoby · Accepted solution]

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@KPardoe wrote:
However, why would I have to generate a mail app password for use on a laptop but not a phone? 

Not sure I can answer that. However,

1. Once a username/password has been accepted by an email server, email apps usually send a token (a bit like a stamped ticket) rather than the full username/password in subsequent transactions. If so the VM server may still be happy to authenticate using that token for the time being based on the fact that no change has been made with the app on that device. Once you updated the password in Outlook on your laptop that means Outlook sends the full username/password which then fails because the VM server is expecting a mail app password.
   
2. The VM SMTP server may not have been updated with your new password. When you reset a password the VM servers do sometimes get out of sync. That can result in the Webmail service being updated with the new password but the SMTP servers still hold the old password. The advice from VM staff is that when you reset a password you should wait 20-30 minutes before accessing the account.  (I have a VM email account that needs one password for the webmail account and different one for Outlook and Thunderbird.I have not changed it because I find it quite amusing and reminds me just how flaky the VM email service has always been, 🙂)
   
   Also, why would the primary account holder not have to do anything like this? 

Presumably they have not reset their password. The need for the Mail app only applies when you reset the account password.

The only reason I tried changing the password for the web login was because that was the only answer I was getting from any VM directed "help". 

Ok, that makes sense but at that point VM should have told you about the need to generate a new mail app password if you were using an email app or client. Sadly VM have not publicised the change they have made regarding mail app passwords,

The only place I have seen it mentioned is here https://www.virginmedia.com/help/broadband/manage-email-account#device   Open that link and scroll down to Setting your app password to use an Email app.

You will see it says "If you want to access your Virgin Media emails from an app, you’ll need to create a separate app password through Account settings on My Virgin Media."

All I can say is that if you have reset your email account password you will need to generate a new Mail App Password.

By all means wait for VM staff to pick up on this thread or try something-else. I'm just trying to offer advice based on my personal experience as a VM customer.

Coenoby

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[coenoby]

@KPardoe 

Thanks for the kudos.

Just rereading  my last post I do seem to come across a bit off hand at the end - it definitely was not intended.

I also realise that I meant to say in that post that I can only offer advice on the error that you are currently seeing with Outlook and your VM account.

It may well be that there was originally a different underlying issue that caused you to reset the password.

However, if you are still seeing an issue after generating a mail app password and updating Outlook accordingly then at least we have removed one possible cause of that underlying problem.

Coenoby

[Zach_R]

Hi @KPardoe,

Thank you for your posts and welcome back to our community forums. We're here to help.

I'm so sorry to hear that you seem to be having some trouble with accessing and using your email account/service via Outlook on your laptop. Have the steps that have been suggested within this thread helped at all?

Thanks,
 

[KPardoe]

Funny that I get a response from a VM Forum Team person ONLY after someone outside of VM has provided a comprehensive reply.  When is there going to be a proper explanation of why there have been so many email problems?  I still haven't resolved the Outlook issue, but mostly because I haven't yet set up the Mail App.  I only changed my password because I was forced into it to be able to access webmail.  I was forced into it because no one from VM could be bothered to reply to my many postings about it OR to the tickets I raised via phone.  I shouldn't have had to change my password unless there was some sort of great **bleep**-up at VM.  Oh wait a second, there was... no apologies and no proper recognition of this by VM.  Roll on Ofcom!

[Zach_R]

Hi @KPardoe, 

It's a shame to hear that you feel this way. I'm afraid our community forums aren't an immediate response contact channel, so it's possible that a member of the community will offer assistance before we're able to.

Have you been able to follow the advice that's been suggested thus far in the thread?

Thanks,
 

[ron_m]

Coenoby,
You stated:-

"To generate a mail app password for your VM email account you need to sign into the My Virgin Media page and go to the "Accounts details" page where you can edit (reset) your password.

Scroll down from there to "Mailbox app password management." and click on "Manage".
You can then generate an app password which will be in the format:           video-post-mossy-sharp
You will then need to enter that new app password (including the "-") into the password field for that email account in your email apps such as Outlook."

This is what I have needed since Thursday 19th July when I could not access my main EMail account due to this password business. I followed the instructions, but to no avail. I posted on here on Saturday 22nd, but did not receive any help, In desperation I rang 150 at 3:15pm and spoke to a Support Op who tried to help and we went round the password loop several times without success and said he would raise a ticket. Tuesday 25th another Support Op rang and again we went through the password loop again without success said they would raise a ticket and escalate my problem. 

After reading your input - You will then need to enter that new app password (including the "-") into the password field for that email account in your email apps such as Outlook!!!!!  This is the part both Support Ops seemed unaware of? We were inputting our password into the box that Outlook Box that popped up (always a couple of times a month the Outlook Box with the cannot sign in message appears). I entered the word-word-word-word into that box pressed Enter, followed by the hard disk churning and 220 EMail messages downloading from the IMAP web server! 

As a result of these problems, I am having to change how I treat my EMails. I originally aggregated all my sub-EMail account EMails into my own main account Inbox and stored them in relevant folders in My EMail account. Now I am trying to move all those "sub" EMail folders back under their own EMail addresses, otherwise a disaster on my account will lose them all.

Kudos to you for making that clear to me - I just need to try and get my head around synchronising the EMails to the IMAP web server. Cheers, Ron.

[KPardoe]

I note that you haven't replied to any of the significant things I raised in my previous post.  Not surprising, but an indictment of the lack of transparency VM wants to maintain about the email problems.  I never expected an immediate reply from the forum, but I have seen many people getting quicker responses for similar or even lower level problems than I have.  I coenoby provided comprehensive and very useful information that I would have thought someone from VM could have provided, but it appears that is all too much for VM to bother to do so.