Recordings From Channel That Has Ceased Broadcasting

[Smokey-Joe]

Hi,

Just a quick one.

Read today that 'Forces TV' is closing down across all platforms.

As an addict of '70s/'80s TV drama, (sentiment rather than discernment), I have a few episodes of various dramas recorded from FTV. As has happened with previous channel closures, will I be locked-out of these recordings when FTV ends? (I seem to remember that when an old SD/HD channel decided to end standalone SD broadcasting, it subsequently rendered my SD recordings 'unavailable'.)

(Just out of interest, if the answer is 'yes'; then WHY? They are already on the HDD. If I transferred them to a dvdr, I'd have them indefinitely.)

Thanks for reading.

[ozsat · Accepted solution]

It is usually about three months after the closure than the recordings are disabled.

[Smokey-Joe]

So you're fairly sure that this is fairly universal for recordings from channels that have stopped broadcasting?

Have you any idea why?

Thanks.

[nodrogd]

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@Smokey-Joe wrote:

So you're fairly sure that this is fairly universal for recordings from channels that have stopped broadcasting?

Have you any idea why?

Thanks.

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Every channel broadcast by Virgin across their system carries a metadata “tag” that identifies it to the channel pack to which it belongs. This tag is also attached to any recordings you make from that channel. When a channel ceases to be broadcast the live tag is removed & replaced with a background version. It is the removal of this background version of the tag which eventually leads to the recordings being unplayable. The length of time the tag is broadcast will depend on Virgins agreement with the broadcaster. Sky insist that all tags are removed immediately, with others it can be anything from 3 to 12 months.

Bear in mind that Virgins agreements are that any recordings are meant to be for “time shifting” purposes only. As such, you don’t own or have any rights to these recordings over and above what Virgin has themselves.

What if I transfer them to DVD-R? Because recordings are encrypted with HDCP, connection to anything other than a TV via HDMI will not work. The only way to copy them would be to convert digital to analogue at the old VHS video 240 line quality. So, if you are happy with blurry-vision analogue recordings on a large screen TV, yes you can make copies.

[Roger_Gooner]

There is a different rule for Sky channels whereby your entitlement to play recordings is removed when you are no longer a subscriber to those channels.

[Smokey-Joe]

Great answer, thanks. Very comprehensive.
Obviously I was aware that 'something' rendered the recordings unplayable, and the 'tag' explanation clarifies that.
I know a little of the nuances of copyright/ownership/intellectual property et al. Nevertheless, it's interesting to read about Virgin's agreements.
I have no idea about encryption whatsoever, apart from being aware that it exists. I did, without question, once transfer some Virgin recordings from an old box to a Panasonic HDD recorder. I still have them as they were transferred to DVD-R. Programmes that were only on pay-channels, and I've had VM since it was United Artists. However, this was long before Tivo/V6. I understand from what you've said that connecting a similar setup now would be pointless?

[ALF28]

Recording that cease to work-

It is common for recording to be "unavailable" a short while (usually a few months) after a channel has been removed from virgin tv, so you can get caught out if you are not aware of the channel removal from the platform.

I have had this a few times on my V6 tv box, and warnings regarding channel removal are easy to miss and when you find out it is too late to watch the recording, it has already been blocked.

I also note the forces  tv Freeview channel 96 ends on 30/6/2022.

It would be interesting to know if this recording issue also happens with Freeview/Freestat recorders if you own the box.

It is possible to record to dvd, I still have my old setup with an alba Freeview box and dvd recorder on a scart leads that can still record without any restrictions but not needed as I use the V6 recorder now.

alf28

[Roger_Gooner]

VM's TV boxes receive encrypted signals and decrypt them when recording. The recording boxes up to the TiVo had a SCART socket or two which enabled you to make SD recordings to a VCR or a DVD recorder. However the content owners hated this and eventually made the operators provide boxes without SCART sockets, which makes recordings onto your own device a much more difficult thing to do.

Incidentally Sky boxes work differently in that recordings are encrypted and you can only play them back if you have the entitlement to do so. So, you could record a bunch of stuff from Sky Cinema and play back once you've subscribed.

[nodrogd]

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@ALF28 wrote:

Recording that cease to work-

It would be interesting to know if this recording issue also happens with Freeview/Freestat recorders if you own the box.

No. It doesn't. The broadcasters lease the space on Freeview, they are not third party TV platform, plus you own the recording equipment.

I have a quite rare piece of kit; a Freeview HD dual tuner recorder with not only an HDD but also a built-in Blu-Ray recorder. So I can record in SD or HD to the HDD & then burn a copies in HD to a BD-R disk. ITV, CH4 & CH5 restrict this one copy only of a programme in HD quality (I can make as many as I like if I convert the recording to SD), but with BBC recordings there is no restrictions

It is possible to record to dvd, I still have my old setup with an alba Freeview box and dvd recorder on a scart leads that can still record without any restrictions but not needed as I use the V6 recorder now.

alf28

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