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Blenky
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Message 21 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"

Like I said earlier if VM had any nous would have this sorted and be advertising themselves as the only major content provider that is offering the full UHD HLG experience. Probably the first time they would have one over Sky! But hey ho.
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ozsat
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Message 22 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"

VM had the Champions League final in UHD - many BT cusotmers couldn't even have that.


@Blenky wrote:
Like I said earlier if VM had any nous would have this sorted and be advertising themselves as the only major content provider that is offering the full UHD HLG experience. Probably the first time they would have one over Sky! But hey ho.

 

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Gmjh
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Message 23 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"

For some reason the sky q box is not listed on the link to 4k bbc World cup. It was on the Planet Earth 4k info though 

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Blenky
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Message 24 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"


@ozsat wrote:

VM had the Champions League final in UHD - many BT cusotmers couldn't even have that.


@Blenky wrote:
Like I said earlier if VM had any nous would have this sorted and be advertising themselves as the only major content provider that is offering the full UHD HLG experience. Probably the first time they would have one over Sky! But hey ho.

 


Did they where, missed that!  Then again BT have been transmitting UHD football since 2015 so it's not new.  What would be new is HLG HDR.

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Roger_Gooner
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Message 25 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"


@BenMcr wrote:

@Gmjh wrote:

 Of course hdr isn't actually needed. The bbc says it's 4k streams will support hdr and non hdr streams. The least virgin could do is have a standard.non hdr 4k stream 


There is only one stream from the BBC. The way HLG works is that it can work across HDR and SDR devices, rather than needing a different streams.

https://www.lifewire.com/dolby-vision-and-hdr10-4060427

However, HLG encoding is just another broadcast signal layer containing added brightness information without the need for specific metadata, that can be placed on top of the current TV signal. As a result, the images can be viewed on any TV. If you don't have an HLG-enabled HDR TV, it will just not recognize the added HDR layer, so you won't get the benefits of the added processing, but you will a standard SDR image.

But as far as I can see the BBC are only doing this for devices that specifically support HLG - for instance there are only 2017 and 2018 Samsung 4K TVs listed, even though earlier 4K Samsung TVs exist.


This is because Samsung is technically unable to provide a firmware upgrade to its pre-2017 4K TVs to enable them to handle DVB-DASH.

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Superuser
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Message 26 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"

Looking at info on another forum the iPlayer currently installed on SkyQ is a download version & not the streaming version the V6 & most SMART TV's have, therefore Sky customers cannot access any 4k content.

su1718.jpgCable customer since 1993. Services: FH TV, Sky Sports & Movies (2xV6), Talk Anytime Phone, VIVID 350, Virgin PAYG Mobile

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Blenky
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Message 27 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"


@Roger_Gooner wrote:

@BenMcr wrote:

@Gmjh wrote:

 Of course hdr isn't actually needed. The bbc says it's 4k streams will support hdr and non hdr streams. The least virgin could do is have a standard.non hdr 4k stream 


There is only one stream from the BBC. The way HLG works is that it can work across HDR and SDR devices, rather than needing a different streams.

https://www.lifewire.com/dolby-vision-and-hdr10-4060427

However, HLG encoding is just another broadcast signal layer containing added brightness information without the need for specific metadata, that can be placed on top of the current TV signal. As a result, the images can be viewed on any TV. If you don't have an HLG-enabled HDR TV, it will just not recognize the added HDR layer, so you won't get the benefits of the added processing, but you will a standard SDR image.

But as far as I can see the BBC are only doing this for devices that specifically support HLG - for instance there are only 2017 and 2018 Samsung 4K TVs listed, even though earlier 4K Samsung TVs exist.


This is because Samsung is technically unable to provide a firmware upgrade to its pre-2017 4K TVs to enable them to handle DVB-DASH.


TBH I think it's more that Samsung claim they are technically unable,  I bet it's possible but they are just not interested.

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Johnny_Boy
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Message 28 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"

My Sony 2016 TV has had HLG for the last couple of firmware updates but BBC had stopped their demo on TiVo by the time it got there. 

I have Sky Q full package on a half-price deal and had a discount on Virgin Full House which was the cheapest way to get BT Sport. That’s run out now and I was going to cancel the TV service from Virgin and just keep broadband and phone,  HDR might have made me think twice about that.

My TV has iPlayer so will take my chances with that as nothing of interest for me on Virgin until next season that I don’t get on Sky. 

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ozsat
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Message 29 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"

Planet Earth was available to download on SkyQ in 4K - but you can not (currently) stream live on a SkyQ box from iPlayer.

The short test loop of Planet Earth was also available but it was not available in HLG/HDR on the SkyQ box as the box does not yet support HDR. However, it the programme on the box had HLG in it then it would prove there was no issue playing the HLG programme on non-HLG kit.

It is the live World Cup matches on iPlayer which will be HDR - so as the SkyQ box can not do LIVE and can not do HDR - it will not be listed.

TiVo V6 with the latest firmware can do both - so hopefully it will be provided the live HLG versions.

 


@Gmjh wrote:

For some reason the sky q box is not listed on the link to 4k bbc World cup. It was on the Planet Earth 4k info though 


 

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dante01
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Message 30 of 723
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Re: BBC iPlayer 4k World Cup coverage confirmed but to be "restricted"

Further technical details of the BBC’s planned UHD HDR World Cup 2018 Coverage

Posted by Phil Layton on 31 May 2018

Each event we have covered has presented different challenges, e.g. my colleague Andrew Cotton recently explained how we developed an HLG HDR live workflow for the Royal Wedding which enabled us to capture the event for posterity in UHD HLG.  For our World Cup coverage, we will be using the FIFA Host Broadcasting Services' UHD HDR feed and adding in our own studio presentation up-converted from HD.

The distribution to iPlayer will be Main 10 Profile, Level 5.1 HEVC with HLG signalling.  This is the same as we used for our Blue Planet II trials.  For Blue Planet II we were able to use non real-time encoding.  For our World Cup 2018 coverage we must use real-time encoding.  The current state of the art for live HEVC encoding means we need to use increased bitrates and reduce the number of representations we can make available.  For the World Cup we will be offering:

3840x2160p50   36Mbit/s

2560x1440p50   16Mbit/s

1920x1080p50   10Mbit/s

1280x720p50      7Mbit/s

The audio will be stereo AAC-LC at 128 kbit/s.  Whilst we would like to provide multi-channel sound we have found a number of issues with receivers which are difficult to work-around.  We will continue to explore solutions for future events.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/blog/2018-05-uhd_hdr_world_cup_2018

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