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Virgin continues to fail to provide acceptable internet radio - the worst ISP in this regard?

MaryTime
Tuning in

I would certainly say so, as drop-outs - server disconnections -  are still depressingly regular. For example, they completely ruined Saturday's Prom on BBC R3 on Saturday, just as they have ruined hundreds of broadcasts for me over the last decade. 

 

What I have started doing recently is to have R3 BBC Sounds running on my iMac so that I can switch the input to my DAC as back up. That means that I don't miss much (just suffer a reduction in sound quality), but, should one have to (and it don't work for non BBC stations)? When other ISP are competent in respect of internet radio/UPnP, why cannot Virgin do it?.

We have no FM feed or signal, hence I am stuck with Virgin's lousy internet radio for the foreseeable future. 

One can reboot, except that rebooting just the Streamer is seldom, if ever, enough, one has to reboot the router (‘hub’), which takes ages, and hence one misses five minutes of broadcast in all. Even then, one is not necessarily immune from further server disconnections.

Equipment - Hub 3, ethernet connected to Cyrus Stream X Signature  https://www.cyrusaudio.com/products/stream-x-signature/

That is what I use, along with many others with good quality audio systems. Internet radio using a quality streamer is the only hi-fi alternative to FM (which I can't get here - wish I could!), insofar as I know. The Cyrus Signature X Streamer work reliably with other ISP, as do other quality streamers, but, not with Virgin, and never have, because you still cannot connect to UPnP servers reliably, and that is disgraceful after so many years. 

21 REPLIES 21

Matthew_ML
Forum Team
Forum Team

Hey MaryTime, thank you for reaching out and I am sorry to hear you are having some issues with BBC radio.

Are the other radio stations working okay?

Please can you let me know what error message you are getting when you try to connect to this server? Thanks 

Matt - Forum Team


New around here?

The problem is as I stated with you dropping UPnP servers, Virgin has always had this problem, as you colleagues have conceded before*, it has nothing to do with BBC, it is just that I listen to BBC more. I am little surprised that you don't know about it, except that Virgin don't seem to care about there performance opposite UPnP servers (if video users experienced the same frequency of drop-outs there would be riots I imagine).

The message is always 'server disconnected'. I was told in the past that upgrading to Hub 3.0 would solve the problem. It didn't. There are probably fewer drop outs because the buffering is better and, hence, not all pauses are terminal now, whereas server disconnections are, since, as I have said, then the Hub 3.0 has to be restarted (which takes ages), because just re-booting the streamer alone just tends give repeat disconnections.  

I have discussed this with Cyrus and those Cyrus users who were on their forum and both (with other ISP) said they just don't get these problems.

* I have complained before occasionally (resulting in Hub upgrade), but only once every 3 or 4 years overall. I should probably have complain everytime I have an evening ruined. I didn't/don't because I am normally so angry that I don't trust myself to be civil at the time. Perhaps I will in future. Not that means every day now, largely because I listening to fewer concerts simply because the drop-outs are so off-putting - so there we are 4-figure Streamer+ 4 figure DAC and I don't use it as much as I would like because of Virgin's poor handling of UPnP servers. 

It really is not good enough and please don't try to blame it on the Beeb.

 

 

jbrennand
Very Insightful Person
Very Insightful Person

Just curious (I know absolutely nothing about this topic)... but just wondering FMI... whether this is an issue that could be simply cured by putting the VM Hub into Modem only mode and using your own better quality router and wireless equipment (I have been doing that for the last 20 years 🙂 )?.

I do appreciate though that you may not want to spend the ~£40-100 to do that.


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John
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I do not work for VM. My services: HD TV on VIP (+ Sky Sports & Movies & BT sport), x3 V6 boxes (1 wired, 2 on WiFi) Hub5 in modem mode with Apple Airport Extreme Router +2 Airport Express's & TP-Link Archer C64 WAP. On Volt 350Mbps, Talk Anytime Phone, x2 Mobile SIM only iPhones.

As I have already said, the streamer is connected via ethernet cable, not wireless. It can be connected wirelessly, but wire is recommended.

The problem most likely is (I am guessing) that Virgin developed their own solution for UPnP servers rather than buying a robust off the shelf solution. /They could sort this, should have done years ago, it is that they haven't that makes me so bloody angry - the fraction of people who listen to extended broadcasts using HD internet radio is so small presumably, that they can get away with treating them with contempt. 

 

 

jbrennand
Very Insightful Person
Very Insightful Person

Well as I said I know nothing about the topic, other than... the way you use the Hub means the ethernet cable is connected via the Hub's router - which over the years has proved problematic for some functions.

As you say VM have a poor record for fixing issues/functions they dont see as "important" (profitable to invest in?) - look at the ipV6 situation as an example

Also, a few years back - gamers were plagued by the Hub3 having a Puma6 chipset. Gamers using a 3d party Hub (AIRI) improved that functionality. It took VM about 2 years after the issue first arose to issue a firmware "workaround" for the router in the Hub3

So I am just wondering whether using a good quality 3d party router that has been powered with a good CPU and programmed correctly - will solve this issue?

There are many experts on here that can answer this question for me - one will hopefully comment in due course.

Cheers


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John
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I do not work for VM. My services: HD TV on VIP (+ Sky Sports & Movies & BT sport), x3 V6 boxes (1 wired, 2 on WiFi) Hub5 in modem mode with Apple Airport Extreme Router +2 Airport Express's & TP-Link Archer C64 WAP. On Volt 350Mbps, Talk Anytime Phone, x2 Mobile SIM only iPhones.

Yes, I can see what you are saying now thanks. I had rather been assuming that Virgin could manage ethernet routing, and they can when it is not UPnP - I don't get any problems with video from any source and I have BB only, no TV as don't own a TV (not since 1999, hence would know how to use one).

I kind of resent having to buy a router when the problem is Virgin, except that if it solved the problem, as this has been driving me nuts for years, hence it is worth thinking about. 

 

Thanks!

 

I used to have an Airport Extreme Router, but one day knocked the power switch on the wall off accidentally and then (this was the mistake) turned it back on immediately and that fried it.

I was almost new and they were expensive then and hence I didn't buy another.

jbrennand
Very Insightful Person
Very Insightful Person
I have had airport equipment since the original grey flying saucer in 2001. My own AE is still going great - I am dreading the day it meets its maker ! I will ask the experts elsewhere to comment on here.

If they reckon a new router will fix it - I will recommend some options

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John
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I do not work for VM. My services: HD TV on VIP (+ Sky Sports & Movies & BT sport), x3 V6 boxes (1 wired, 2 on WiFi) Hub5 in modem mode with Apple Airport Extreme Router +2 Airport Express's & TP-Link Archer C64 WAP. On Volt 350Mbps, Talk Anytime Phone, x2 Mobile SIM only iPhones.

Thanks. I am not hopeful of much as UpNP servers are a bit niche, but you never know. 

Suggestions would be appreciated. I don't need mind-bending wi-fi as there is only me in a flat, most of the time, and iMac  is ethernet, hence only 'phone and iPad connect wirelessly. I don't 'game' (which used to mean 'gamble' when I was younger).

regards,