4G/5G cellular backup for Virgin Media SuperHub

[Mark-Guildford]

Can anybody recommend a good, automated 4G/5G cellular backup solution for Virgin Media SuperHub?

If I'm at home, I can use my smartphone's wireless hotspot mode to connect my laptop etc. to the internet.  But I also have lots of other devices which are connected to the internet - home alarm system, security cameras, Hive devices etc., and I they only connect to my regular home wireless network.  I don't want to lose the internet connectivity on all of those devices if my Virgin Media broadband goes down, or if somebody decides to maliciously cut my my Virgin Media coax cable, which is very easily visible.

I have a SuperHub 5, and it works fine.  But I can't see any way to add an additional backup internet connection.  My Virgin Media service has been relatively stable in the past few months, but I remember in the past when it was constantly dropping its internet connection, and I want to be prepared for that.  Some routers have a USB port which can be used to add a cellular USB dongle for backup internet service, but the SuperHub 5 doesn't have one.  Now that Virgin Media are under the same ownership as O2, hopefully this is something which we'll see in the future.  They are apparently already offering something like that for Business customers, but not for those of us on Consumer contracts.

I see that some wireless routers from companies like TP-Link now have a nano-SIM slot which can be used as a backup, with the router switching automatically from the WAN port to the nano-SIM if it loses its internet connectivity on the WAN port.  Right now, I'm thinking that my best option is probably to buy one of these kind of routers from TP-Link, Asus etc., take out a separate monthly subscription for a nano-SIM card to go in it, put my Virgin Media SuperHub 5 into modem-only mode, and connect the new router to the SuperHub just for modem functionality.  Is there any reason why this would not work with Virgin Media broadband?  Does anybody have any alternative suggestions?

[Tudor]

"Do you mind me asking which model of Ubiqiti hardware you use?"

I use a UDM Pro router and Unifi LTE. By the way the router has no WiFi, you need to use access pointes, I use UAP Pros.

[Mark-Guildford]

The D-Link website here shows a D-Link device called G416, which apparently is a wifi 6 router with built-in 4G LTE SIM card slot, and they say is has fail-safe internet ("Disruptions can happen when you least expect it. We’ve built the G416 to eliminate them altogether with dual-WAN auto-failover technology.").  Unfortunately, according to their website here, it shows it still as "Coming Soon".

[jpeg1]

Check out the Draytek routers. 

[Mark-Guildford]

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@carl_pearce wrote:

I use an Asus RT-AX86U, which has a 2.5Gbps ethernet port you can assign as WAN.

It then allows you to use one of the other 1Gbps ports as a second WAN to failover to in case of primary WAN failure, which is automated.

I got a B535-232 with a Three data only SIM deal a while back which was plugged into the secondary WAN.

Worked well when I used it.

So yes, it would work with the HUB 5 in modem mode.

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Doesn’t it cause problems if you have one router connected to another router?

[legacy1]

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@Mark-Guildford wrote:

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Doesn’t it cause problems if you have one router connected to another router?

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Sometimes it can't be helped but it is something you want to avoid. I have a Nighthawk M2 Mobile Router by default its LAN is 192.168.1.x my backup subnet is 192.168.247.x in order to use the 4G I have to SNAT from 192.168.1.x but then the Nighthawk gets a WAN IP of 10. from 4G so you SNAT again triple NAT I use IP passthrough so VPN300 gets 10. by 4G but thats still double NAT.

[Mark-Guildford]

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@legacy1 wrote:

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@Mark-Guildford wrote:

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Doesn’t it cause problems if you have one router connected to another router?

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Sometimes it can't be helped but it is something you want to avoid. I have a Nighthawk M2 Mobile Router by default its LAN is 192.168.1.x my backup subnet is 192.168.247.x in order to use the 4G I have to SNAT from 192.168.1.x but then the Nighthawk gets a WAN IP of 10. from 4G so you SNAT again triple NAT I use IP passthrough so VPN300 gets 10. by 4G but thats still double NAT.

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Thank you for your advice. Unfortunately, I don’t really understand what any of that means! So I guess I’m best off staying away from those kinds of issues, and sticking with something which doesn’t need too much networking technical expertise! So right now, I’m thinking that I have a couple of options:

• Get a 4G/5G home broadband router, and just keep it separate, in case my main broadband goes down. I could set it up with the same SSID’s as my regular Virgin Media hub. If my Virgin broadband goes down, I could just turn off the Superhub completely, and turn on the home broadband hub. Then unplug the Ethernet cable from my switch and hook it up to the 4G/5G home broadband router instead. That way, everything should connect to the internet automatically; it would just require manual unplugging and replugging. Three UK are doing a great deal on their 5G Home Broadband at the moment, at £10 for first 6 months then £20 for the following 18 months, and that includes the cost of the hub itself, and unlimited data.
• Buy one of the more expensive routers with a built-in SIM card slot and automatic failsafe switching from Virgin broadband to the 4G SIM. But I don’t see any such 5G routers available yet, only 3G and 4G.

My Virgin Media broadband has been much more stable recently than it was in the past. But it did go down completely for about 1.5 hours yesterday, which is what prompted me to start looking into this question again.

[StuBFrost]

Stick the virgin hub into modem mode and buy a tp-link x20-4g router. Uses the hub as long as the internet is working and then falls back to sim slot when not working. 

[Mark-Guildford]

Are Draytek routers easy to configure, for a non-IT person? I’ve had internet access problems with Virgin again recently, so I was looking at the Draytek Vigor 2927 range, which indeed seem to have a good reputation, and which seems to include many different options (LTE, wifi / non-wifi etc.). But I’m not an IT specialist. I’m comfortable logging into a router’s web browser interface, configuring SSID’s and passwords etc., but my knowledge does not extend far beyond that!

[Mark-Guildford]

In case anybody is looking back through this thread at some point in the future, I just wanted to update it with what I eventually did.  I purchased a Draytek Vigor 2927 router, put my Virgin Media Superhub into modem only mode and connected it to the Draytek router.  I then took out a subscription with 3 for a 5G home broadband connection, which came with a free ZTE MC801A 5G router.  I then put this ZTE MC801A into modem mode also (they call it "Bridge Mode"), but please note that I was only able to do this using my laptop browser, not my iPhone browser.  It took me a lot of messing around, but I think it's all working now.  I had to do various resets of all the devices in order for the Draytek router to recognize the Virgin Media superhub in router mode, because when I initially plugged it in, it was in router mode, and when I switched it to modem mode it no longer worked.  The Draytek router apparently doesn't always play nicely with Virgin Media Superhubs.  I had purchased the Draytek router on eBay second hand, and the person who sold it to me was super knowledgeable and super helpful to help me resolve my issues.

I think the 5G home broadband from 3 is a pretty good deal.  I didn't have to pay anything up-front, the ZTE 5G router is provided free of charge, and I pay £20 per month, but the first 3 months are free.  It was up and running within about an hour of picking it up from my local 3 shop. One thing to note is that the 3 website said that I didn't have good enough coverage for 5G home broadband, so if I had ordered it online they would have only given me a 4G router.  But I went into the 3 shop and showed them my mobile phone screenshot to prove that I did actually have 5G coverage indoors in the exact location where I wanted to put this 5G router.  In any case, even if there is no 5G signal, this ZTE device will fall back to 4G.  So I see no point in going for a 4G router.  The download speeds with the 5G router are really good, about 200Mbps.  The upload speeds are much, much lower, at about 3Mbps.  But as I only intend to use this 5G router as a backup, I'm fine with that.  I understand that the ZTE is not the only model of 5G router which 3 provide.  The guy in the shop told me it just depends which one they have available.  From what I can see online, it looks like one of the other models they provide is a Zyxel NR5103E.  

It was quite tricky getting everything set up with the Draytek router.  There are just so many different settings on it.  I had initially planned to set it up with load balancing, so that I could get the combined download speeds of both my Virgin Media SuperHub and also the 5G router, but I just couldn't get it to work properly.  So in the end I just configured it so that the Virgin Media SuperHub is the primary connection and the 5G router is just there as a backup.

There are different versions of the Draytek Vigor 2927 router.  I got the most basic one, which has neither wifi nor 4G LTE modem built in.  I paid £150 for it on eBay.  Because it doesn't have wifi, I then had to buy a standalone Wireless Access Point, and I picked up a Netgear WAX206 brand new on eBay for just £35, and this has wifi 6.  Going with the basic Draytek router means that I can easily upgrade the wireless access point in the future if I need to.  Also, the version of the Draytek Vigor 2927 which has built-in modem is only 4G, not 5G, so the standalone ZTE 5G router from 3 will provide better download/upload speed than a 4G modem.  Also, the version of the Draytek Vigor 2927 which has cellular modem only has ac wifi rather than ax (ie. wifi 6).

You can find out more about the Draytek Vigor 2927 series devices at https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/business/vigor-2927-series.  The exact model number for the most basic version, which I bought is Vigor 2927.  The one with ac wifi is Vigor 2927ac.  The one with ax wifi is Vigor 2927ax.  The one with LTE (4G) cellular modem and ac wifi is Vigor 2927Lac.

I hope that the above is helpful for anybody, like me, who wants to be able to have a backup internet solution for their Virgin Media service.

[jpeg1]

So in the end I just configured it so that the Virgin Media SuperHub is the primary connection and the 5G router is just there as a backup.

I'm not sure from this whether you have the correct settings, but you can set the options for the two WAN inputs so that the VM uses the faster cable service normally but falls over seamlessly to the 4G if there is any interruption. You won't notice it has happened.