1gig, hub 5, unusable for online gaming, packet loss and latency issues

[JuicyGoomba]

Hello,

I've been with Virgin for almost 4 years now, as they are unfortunately the only provider nearby that does high speed broadband.

I say unfortunately, because I have nothing but issues both with dropouts and online gameplay since joining Virgin. The Hub 3 and Hub 4 were both awful even in modem mode and contributed their fair share towards the issues. I've recently managed to get upgraded to the Hub 5, but aside from the dropouts being fixed, the issues with latency and packet loss continue.

Online gaming is virtually impossible now. Even when the latency is good, I get constant packet loss varying from 1%-5%. 1% is noticeable, especially on competitive games, and 5% is just a waste of time. I setup a BQM a couple of days ago along with the Hub 5, the connection seemed relatively stable for the first day outside of a single large latency spike, but the packet loss could still be seen. As the days have gone by, the packet loss has only increased in number and frequency, as has the latency issues.

My current network setup is as barebones as can be. I previously had the Hub 4 in modem mode, connected to a Nest Wifi router as it was noticeably more reliable for everything. I've since been trialing the Hub 5 as the only router, and all I have connected to it is 2x phones via wifi, 1x Fire Stick by ethernet, and 2x PCs by ethernet. In fairness to the Hub 5, it is actually capable of functioning as a decent router, and is comparable to the Nest Wifi in performance (likely helped by no longer using the god awful Intel Puma chip in the Hub 3/4).

I figured only having the Virgin router and a barebones setup would at least help with finding the issues here. The packet loss is just as bad as with the Hub 3/4, as is the latency spikes. As I said before, the only improvement so far is that I don't have dropouts as far as I can see. The Hub 4 in modem mode still required an almost daily power cycle to maintain some degree of stability.

I have shared the BQM below. I'm currently debating switching to BT's slow copper FTTC for the sake of making online gameplay usable. I play a lot of competitive shooters, and it is literally killing me. Even online coop games were unplayable with the Hub 4 due to the dropouts. My neighbour is 3 doors down connected to the same line, and he has all of the same issues.

I've tried all the usual fault reporting processes via the My Virgin area, but the whole process is as useless as it is frustrating.

I have also attached my logs from the router below as well, if that helps.

Spoiler

Upstream:

Upstream bonded channels

Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) Symbol Rate (ksps) Modulation Channel ID

0	49600000	43	5120	QAM 64	1
1	43100000	42	5120	QAM 64	2
2	36600000	41.5	5120	QAM 64	3
3	30100000	41	5120	QAM 64	4
4	23600000	41	5120	QAM 64	5

Upstream bonded channels

Channel Channel Type T1 Timeouts T2 Timeouts T3 Timeouts T4 Timeouts

0	ATDMA	0	0	0	0
1	ATDMA	0	0	0	0
2	ATDMA	0	0	0	0
3	ATDMA	0	0	0	0
4	ATDMA	0	0	0	0

Spoiler

Downstream:

Channel Frequency (Hz) Power (dBmV) SNR (dB) Modulation Channel ID

1	330000000	3	42	QAM 256	25
2	138000000	6.9	43	QAM 256	1
3	146000000	6.7	43	QAM 256	2
4	154000000	6.4	43	QAM 256	3
5	162000000	5.8	43	QAM 256	4
6	170000000	5.6	43	QAM 256	5
7	178000000	5.5	43	QAM 256	6
8	186000000	5.5	43	QAM 256	7
9	194000000	5.6	43	QAM 256	8
10	202000000	5.3	43	QAM 256	9
11	210000000	5.2	43	QAM 256	10
12	218000000	4.3	42	QAM 256	11
13	226000000	3.2	42	QAM 256	12
14	234000000	3	42	QAM 256	13
15	242000000	2.8	42	QAM 256	14
16	250000000	2.7	42	QAM 256	15
17	258000000	2.7	42	QAM 256	16
18	266000000	2.6	42	QAM 256	17
19	274000000	2.6	42	QAM 256	18
20	282000000	2.6	42	QAM 256	19
21	290000000	2.7	42	QAM 256	20
22	298000000	2.7	42	QAM 256	21
23	306000000	2.7	42	QAM 256	22
24	314000000	2.8	42	QAM 256	23
25	322000000	2.9	42	QAM 256	24
26	338000000	3.2	43	QAM 256	26
27	346000000	3.1	43	QAM 256	27
28	354000000	2.7	42	QAM 256	28
29	362000000	2.4	42	QAM 256	29
30	370000000	2.1	42	QAM 256	30
31	378000000	1.9	42	QAM 256	31

Downstream bonded channels

Channel Locked Status RxMER (dB) Pre RS Errors Post RS Errors

1	Locked	42	12705	0
2	Locked	43	1522	0
3	Locked	43	1947	0
4	Locked	43	1912	0
5	Locked	43	2770	0
6	Locked	43	6614	124
7	Locked	43	3360	0
8	Locked	43	3149	0
9	Locked	43	3123	0
10	Locked	43	2718	0
11	Locked	43	3617	0
12	Locked	42	3370	0
13	Locked	42	3967	0
14	Locked	42	4525	0
15	Locked	42	5927	0
16	Locked	42	6581	0
17	Locked	42	7539	0
18	Locked	42	7913	0
19	Locked	42	7187	0
20	Locked	42	8266	0
21	Locked	42	10488	0
22	Locked	42	13910	0
23	Locked	42	13019	0
24	Locked	42	11273	0
25	Locked	42	12152	0
26	Locked	43	15691	0
27	Locked	43	14751	0
28	Locked	42	18280	0
29	Locked	42	20581	0
30	Locked	42	25315	0
31	Locked	42	33029	0

Spoiler

Router network log for today:

Time Priority Description

13-03-2023 16:12:36	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 16:12:36	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 12 13; New Profile: 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 15:35:26	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 11 13; New Profile: 12 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 15:35:26	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 15:35:23	error	DHCP RENEW WARNING - Field invalid in response v4 option;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 14:52:57	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 14:52:57	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 12 13; New Profile: 11 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:49:29	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 11 13; New Profile: 12 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:49:29	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:42:13	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:42:13	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 13; New Profile: 11 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:11:43	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:11:43	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 12 13; New Profile: 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:08:58	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 11 13; New Profile: 12 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 13:08:58	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 12:43:13	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 12:43:13	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 13; New Profile: 11 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 12:12:45	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 12 13; New Profile: 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 12:12:45	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 11:12:55	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 11 13; New Profile: 12 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 11:12:55	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 10:16:46	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 12 13; New Profile: 11 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 10:16:46	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 09:14:06	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 11 13; New Profile: 12 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 09:14:06	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 08:26:01	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 08:26:01	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 12 13; New Profile: 11 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 06:24:52	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 06:24:52	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 11 13; New Profile: 12 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 06:14:45	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 06:14:45	notice	US profile assignment change. US Chan ID: 6; Previous Profile: 12 13; New Profile: 11 13.;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;
13-03-2023 05:08:19	warning	DBC-REQ Mismatch Between Calculated Value for P1.6hi Compared to CCAP Provided Value;CM-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CMTS-MAC=**:**:**:**:**:**;CM-QOS=1.1;CM-VER=3.1;

[JuicyGoomba]

Packet loss seems to be minimal from 12am to 8am each day. Reset the hub again, setup a new monitor, same outcome. The random large spikes aren't helping either.

The packet loss is particularly nasty right now. Again, online gaming is impossible, streams keep cutting out, and websites will randomly stop responding due to the packet loss. Even the built in compensation methods all of these online services have can't prevent failures due to the sheer amount of loss occuring.

Other than the connection issues all day today as usual, the packet loss from 4pm onwards is abysmal and completely unacceptable.

[darmo]

Surprised no one from VM has jumped on this thread or DM’s you yet. 

[Adduxi]

Your stats are all good, except for one DS channel showing PostRS errors. Ideally they should all be zero.  Also your US is flapping from one Profile to another.  I would have though it should be stable on one Profile?

As for packet loss in the afternoon/evenings I would normally suggest over subscription in the area, but the BQM does not show this and it normally would.

As an aside, when I needed redundancy for work, I used to run VM and BT together on a Dual WAN router and routed all my gaming traffic via BT (running at around 65/18)  circuit, even though it was a lot slower, it was better for gaming.

[JuicyGoomba]

The packet loss is very sporadic and sadly I don't think it's consistent enough to show up. From about 4pm onwards it usually sits at less than 1% until the big spikes hit. 

Last night was a mess. As expected after running for a few days longer the stability is getting worse however the giant spike happened for everyone in the street, coincidentally right after I got a engineer booked through live chat. 

As for the channel swapping, it does this up to 30-40 times per day since I got the Hub 5. The Hub 4 had about a quarter of the errors/warnings at most, yet constantly dropped connection...Switches channels a few times a day. 

[Jigsy75]

Blimey I'm glad I found this post because playing 2042 at the minute is just impossible. I literally play for 5 minutes then see people running in the air before being booted to the main loading screen.

[JuicyGoomba]

The first settings page on 2042 should have a "Network" tab, you can go in there and enable the graphcs at the bottom, select "Always".

For me right now it's showing between 3-5% packet loss on uploaded packets (PL OUT) on 2042, it's completely unplayable.

Worst part is, BQM doesn't show any of these moments.

[JJG92]

@JuicyGoomba are you in the 02 area code as your BQM chart looks exacly like mine did on the 15th march, ive hade sevral new lines, new tap and a new node fitted at the exchange yet the same issue is happning in the area i am, hight latency spikes in games and dropped packets nirly every day.

[JuicyGoomba]

In the 01 area, by the looks of it the whole network must have had issues at the same time last night. Good to know it isn't our local boxes though!

On the plus side you don't have the big packet loss spikes for the most part, but BQM really doesn't tell the whole story. 

[JJG92]

When i ring just get same ancer every time blaiming my equiptment, but its the same even when using just the hub. Glad im leaving i get cityfibre installed next week and my virgin gets disconnected in aprill.

[JuicyGoomba]

Unfortunately that's the first red flag when it comes to any business. It's called giving you the run around.

The longer they do it, the longer they retain your contract value, and ultimately your money. It's frustrating, but at the same time Virgin are relying on such old wiring for their network that they literally can't do anything until it's all replaced by fibre cable in the next 5 years.

Unfortunately for them, BT will have installed a large amount of their full fibre network and will have lapped up all the frustrated Virgin customers with plenty of discount offers.

Glad you don't have to suffer with this any longer and theres a suitably fast replacement in your area! No more pain 🙂

This is the last 24 hours, the packet loss is at least consistently showing up on the graph now. Unusable for gaming, but I'm (stupidly) going to attempt to play the Diablo 4 beta later tonight. I expect much rage and disappointment as I die over and over again due to the uploaded packets not leaving the area and Blizzard's servers seeing me as idle.

If the engineer is unable to fix this at the weekend, the packet loss that is (variable latency is fine as long as the damn packets get to where they need to be), then the complaints dept will be getting an earful sadly. I expect to be on old slow BT FTTC by the end of next week going by other users experience on here.