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fowlesp
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Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains

Since May 2018 I've stopped receiving emails from my energy supplier 'noreply@mail.first-utility.com'

They have since rebranded to shellenergy.co.uk, but emails are STILL no being received. Shell Energy have confirmed that the emails are being delivered (they get a SMTPERR code of 250), but they do not appear in any spam or junk folders

Has anyone else seen this issue?

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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains

I would recommend logging in to webmail and going to Settings then Email filters to see if there are are any unfamiliar filters set up.

Tim

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fowlesp
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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains

I should have mentioned this.

I checked (and recheck) Spam and Filters, and there are NO settings that could account for this
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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains

Is the mail being sent directly to a virgin media address?  Or is it being sent to a different address and then forwarded?

Tim

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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains

Emails are being forwarded

 

I've also checked with my forwarding ISP (GoDaddy) and the forewards are set up correctly. There are also no Spam or Filter settings that could be blocking emails there.

The forward alias is my main email address, so I know this works for all other email messages

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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains


@fowlesp wrote:

Emails are being forwarded

I do get fed up when people miss out that information.

I've also checked with my forwarding ISP (GoDaddy) and the forewards are set up correctly. There are also no Spam or Filter settings that could be blocking emails there.

You need to check with GoDaddy to find out if they got a 250 status code for the delivery of the email or something else.  When you have a chain like this you have to follow the chain. Your power supplier would have got the 250 status code from GoDaddy's SMTP server

The forward alias is my main email address, so I know this works for all other email messages


The reason I asked the above is because your energy supplier has DMARC set up with a p=reject policy

C:\Users\timdu_000>dig _dmarc.shellenergy.co.uk txt

; <<>> DiG 9.11.8 <<>> _dmarc.shellenergy.co.uk txt
;; global options: +cmd
;; Got answer:
;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 32754
;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 1

;; OPT PSEUDOSECTION:
; EDNS: version: 0, flags:; udp: 4096
;; QUESTION SECTION:
;_dmarc.shellenergy.co.uk.      IN      TXT

;; ANSWER SECTION:
_dmarc.shellenergy.co.uk. 3600  IN      TXT     "v=DMARC1; p=reject; pct=100; rua=mailto:re%2Bw1toy7iqvhc@dmarc.postmarkapp.com;"

;; Query time: 38 msec
;; SERVER: 127.0.0.1#53(127.0.0.1)
;; WHEN: Tue Aug 13 21:59:38 GMT Summer Time 2019
;; MSG SIZE  rcvd: 145

While one would hope that such a company would be signing their mails with DKIM, without seeing a mail, I can't rule out the fact that they might not be.  There are also forwarding servers that break DKIM too.  Forwarding breaks SPF so if there is a problem/non existent DKIM signature I can easily imagine Virgin Media would reject the forwarded mails.

So there are a number of options here:

1. Take forwarding out of the mix altogether and see what happens when your energy supplier delivers directly to your VM inbox.

2.Ask GoDaddy to check what happened to a specific mail.  Your energy supplier should be able to see the following in their logs:

Aug 14 03:55:05 box postfix/smtp[15103]: 98FE220D94: to=<me@blueyonder.co.uk>, relay=mx.mnd.ukmail.iss.as9143.net[212.54.58.11]:25, delay=0.94, delays=0.14/0.06/0.16/0.58, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (250 2.0.0 MXIN650 mail accepted for delivery ;id=xjRIh6loCfVYNxjRIhdnmL;sid=xjRIh6loCfVYN;mta=mx5.mnd;d=20190814;t=045505[CET];ipsrc=77.68.89.100;)

Note that the bit in red identifies the SMTP transaction on the server that accepted the mail.  GoDaddy could use that information to follow the mail on their system to find out exactly what happened to the mail after it arrived in order to check whether VM accepted or rejected the mail.

Tim

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fowlesp
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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains

Thanks for this Tim,

I'd be interested to know why forwarding "breaks" BOTH SPF and DKIM as the validations should be between my energy supplier and the GoDaddy server?

Given that single-shot emails from shellenergy.co.uk are delivered successfully, I'm going to look into the DKIM signatures from their bulk email provider; but I'll also try your option 1 (to take the forwarding out of the equation)

thanks again - I'll let you know what happens, though I may have to wait for their next bulk email shot
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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains

Forwarding almost always breaks SPF because the message is being sent on from an IP address which probably isn’t included in the SPF DNS record.

Forwarding ‘shouldn’t’ necessarily break DKIM but it depends if the forwarding system makes any changes to either the message headers or body. If it does then the DKIM checks will fail.

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Re: Not receiving incoming emails from certain domains


@fowlesp wrote:
Thanks for this Tim,

I'd be interested to know why forwarding "breaks" BOTH SPF and DKIM as the validations should be between my energy supplier and the GoDaddy server?

Wrong - validations happen at the mail exchangers, i.e. the servers that receive a domains mail.  Thus when you forward a mail, validation happens twice.

1.  Between shellenergy and GoDaddy
2. Between GoDaddy and Virgin Media.

But Virgin Media are validating against shellenergy's SPF and DKIM records (which is why SPF will fail in 99% of cases).  Given that single shot emails get through, it doesn't sound as if GoDaddy are altering the mail.  However I have seen servers do this, so it is something that needed considering.  DKIM does normally survive forwarding, although it's not suited for use in certain circumstances.


Given that single-shot emails from shellenergy.co.uk are delivered successfully, I'm going to look into the DKIM signatures from their bulk email provider; but I'll also try your option 1 (to take the forwarding out of the equation)

thanks again - I'll let you know what happens, though I may have to wait for their next bulk email shot

I still think it's worth asking either:
1. GoDaddy to look at their email logs
2.shellenergy to check for any bounces from Virgin Media.

As if we can get error messages, we wouldn't be guessing as to why the mail isn't getting through.

Alternatively, the @ModTeam could try and escalate to Liberty Global to see if they can find the mails hitting their servers.  For that, they would normally need to know the address that the mail is being forwarded to.  (Note:  Don't post any info on the open Forum, if they do want to try, they'll ask for info via PM).

BTW - Please unmark my response as helpful answer, it's not been solved yet.

Tim

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