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AJStevens
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Super Hub 3 rubbish

So I finally gave in to the nagging from Virgin to upgrade my equipment, as faster speeds were around the corner and I would miss out.

I had heard of the nightmares otherwise known as the "Super Hub" and had steered away from it, my trusty but old Virgin Modem has served me well these years, that's right MODEM, not a hub in anyway.

So I didn't upgrade to the Super Hub, I didn't upgrade to the Super Hub 2, and I'm beginning to wish I'd stayed like that and hadn't upgraded to the Super Hub 3.

Why? I heard how they messed up the Modem Mode, I remember when the Super Hub first came out and they neglected to put in a Modem Mode to start with, I knew it would drag on and be a pain.

However, not even I thought that the 3rd generation of this thing from Virgin Media would STILL have problems, this is absolutely ridiculous.

Bad omen I got two emails and two text messages regarding delivery on a Saturday, then a Wednesday, then the following Wednesday, then the following Saturday... seriously was thing ever going to come?

They lulled me into a false sense of security, once it had finally turned up on the 2nd Saturday, I swapped it out, changed it to modem mode... and it worked, well once I realized I had to call the number and get it activated, which I presumed killed off my old one from being allowed to connect, a bit of a while after that and a few more reboots, we got internet through it.

All is going fine for a week or so, then boom, one night at 3am it just stops working, no internet is passing through the "Super" Hub 3.

So I waste my time flipping between modes, with a computer plugged directly into it trying to work out what the problem is.

Along the way I discover, the reboot command in the web interface does absolutely nothing, whatever mode you're in the LEDs on the front don't work, the arrows or wi-fi may appear green only briefly shortly after first rebooting it then are never seen again, aside from the "mode" LED of course that's either Purple/Magenta in Modem mode or white/slightly cyan in Router mode.

I've tried a reset to factory defaults to see if that sorts it out, nope.

I notice when using a PC directly to it, I get much different DHCP information (and no, I'm not talking about the local ranges (192.168.0.* and 192.168.100.*), on the PC I get an IP on a /24 subnet mask but my router gets an IP on a /23 subnet mask (if you don't understand what that means, don't bother replying, not to be rude, but IT and networking is my profession).

For my router, it can't get internet and it can't get a response from the supposed gateway, however it's the same DHCP server IP for both the router and PC, is this normal? Do Virgin stick us "Modem Mode" users into a separate DHCP IP pool? Or is the Virgin DHCP server sending me into a black hole by instruction of this "super" hub 3?

Trying to release the IP (yes, my router allows me to do that, this isn't some cheap router from D-Link or Netgear, this is more like Cisco kit) it of course just gets the same DHCP information again.

 

I'm really not looking forward to have to deal with some script first line support person, us advanced users should be able to skip these guys out and get straight in touch with a fast line 3rd level support tech.

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Re: Super Hub 3 rubbish

http://help.virginmedia.com/system/selfservice.controller?CMD=VIEW_ARTICLE&ARTICLE_ID=27651&CURRENT_...

"The behaviour of the lights on the Hub 3.0 are different compared to other routers. The lights on the Hub 3.0 will only be lit if there is an issue, otherwise, with the exception of the Base LED, the lights will be off."

Ok, fair enough... very strange though compared to other makes and models... should highlight that somewhere on the unit...

 

First call attempt, I was told to restart my router... which I did, also told them I'd rebooted and factory reset the super hub 3, then the "script guy" hung up on me while he was speaking... seriously they can't operate a telephone, how are they supposed to help us with broadband issues??

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Re: Super Hub 3 rubbish

Second call, this time she's unwell, got a headache, and only 30 minutes left of her shift... gets me to use the reset button on the back, twice, and begins to talk me through what I believe was a dhcp release and renew on the computer but before we get that far, I get a recorded messaged "... thank you and goodbye." <hang up>

I swear this is a scam by Virgin Media to make a vault, make me call and cost me the time on the phone!

I NEED 3rd line support, the poxy Virgin DHCP server is purposely sending my router duff DHCP information, only 3rd line can fix this.

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Re: Super Hub 3 rubbish

Evidently, "first line" is all there is at the moment, all other departments who maybe able to help me are closed, I'm told they're open at 8am tomorrow, seeing as that's not only a Saturday but also Christmas Eve, I won't get my hopes up.

Nice Christmas present from Virgin Media... we'll break your internet because we don't like your setup/router.

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Re: Super Hub 3 rubbish

Ok this is the same situation as me, but different firewall/router and I'm not trying to spoof the Virgin Hub's MAC address on my router.

http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Networking-and-wireless/SuperHub-3-0-No-internet-connection/m-p/...

Will give that a go and see if I can get it to give me functioning IP information.

Virgin need to know their DHCP server is damn awful and fix it.
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Re: Super Hub 3 rubbish

Hmm.. think it might need to be longer than a few minutes... I even did a release right before as well, got the same IP again.

 

That other thread gave me an idea though, so just to see what would happen, I spoofed another mac, I got different IP information (not the same as the direct laptop) but a /24 subnet.

Still couldn't get internet, but I was able to ping the default gateway from the router.. for a while, then it stopped responding.

Urgh... something very wrong in Virgin's kit that doesn't like me... this started at 3am on the 21st, was fine before then.

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Re: Super Hub 3 rubbish

Your IP address is dependent on the MAC address of the internet facing device, so it is not surprising your IP address is changing with different devices as they will have different MAC addresses.

There has been very few reports on these Forum about the SHs misbehaving in modem mode. When there are problems a Factory Reset of the Hub usually sorts it out unless the unit is faulty which does happen on occasion.

No idea how you are concluding what subnet mask VM's DHCP server is using, but a CIDR /23 subnet mask giving 512 possible network addresses, seems a bit sparse for the thousands of customers connected to that node. Whilst you may be able to do a refresh\renew on the LAN\WLAN IPs on the DHCP server of the hub, you will not be able to do it on VM's DHCP servers that give you your Public IP address.

Rebooting the Hub will request a new IP address, but it will be the same IP as you had previously has as VM's IP addresses, though dynamic tend to do be very sticky.

Did you consider it maybe it's just a service outage? Things do break, and fairplay VM's First Line Support is quite atrocious, so I would take everything they say with a pinch of salt.

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Re: Super Hub 3 rubbish

Hi griffin,

Thanks for the reply, not as bad as I thought I'd get.

I didn't express surprise at a different IP, yes of course presenting Virgin with a new MAC address will receive a new IP address from the VM DHCP server. I was just surprised the subnet mask was a /23 being given for my router but a /24 for a computer connected directly to the VM super hub 3 (still in modem mode and yes I have a good firewall on the machine).

Sadly the factory reset doesn't appear to have helped, either in web interface or the reset hole, just made me have to select the language again etc.

However, it's unclear if it is the super hub, VM's DHCP server, general VM network or some weird combination as it works with a PC direct attached in Modem Mode.

As I said, my router is along the lines of a professional Cisco, not a regular home cheap D-Link or Netgear, it has a terminal ("command line") I can see what the DHCP client of my router received from Virgin hub/DHCP server.
Or in the case of a computer directly attached in modem mode, open properties of the Ethernet connection and you can see the IP and subnet mask you were given, along with default gateway (your next hop in Virgin's network) and DNS servers.

A DHCP server doesn't just have to serve one single subnet of IPs (as the basic home router ones do), anyone involved in networking can tell you a DHCP server can have hundreads, thousands, etc of subnets to dish out.
Two problems of course, DHCP only works over a single network segment directly connected to the DHCP server and how does it know to send the correct details? No one wants hundreads of network ports on the DHCP server so Answer is DHCP relay, all switches pickup the broadcast requests from clients attached to them and forward that request with the source Network to the DHCP server, DHCP server replies back to the request with the information and the switch gives that to the client requesting it (simplified, there's a bit more to and fro, handshake and the like), but basically switches play an intermediate role to allow DHCP across network segments such as subnets/VLANs.

Therefore it's no surprise it would be giving out IPs and different subnets to cover everyone, however strange that they are different subnet sizes, you would expect consistency in that area at least in that node, and I thought that may have been the problem, however using a new MAC address I got a /24 and still had the same problem.

I can't get to anything, for a short time the default gateway I'm given responds to a ping but then stops responding after a while.

Yes, I can only release from my side and I thought it unlikely this would remove it from Virgin's side, I can only think that other user was extremely lucky, perhaps there was a shortage of IPs at the time and some cleanup process ran at just the right time for him.

Yes, Virgin connections seem to really hold the IP, they must have a shockingly long lease time for an ISP DHCP.

I've tested the line and speaking to three first liners they all could see the modem working in modem mode, which seems to point to the hub not passing traffic from my router.

Can't see what kind of service outage it would be that blocks my router but allows a PC to connect while still in modem mode, could be a coincidence and my router is getting bad IP information through, perhaps a bad switch shortly after my hub.

Or my "super hub 3" just doesn't like working with other routers and just isn't passing the traffic perhaps it had a firmware upgrade a few nights ago at 3am, since I believe the behaviour of the lights (in one small paragraph on a support page) did acknowledge that older firmware may still have the green lights active).

It's infruriating and what's worse is having to go through the first line, no I don't have Windows 10, this is Windows 7, a Mac, an Xbox, an iPhone, you name it.
I've already turned everything off and on and reset it, I need your escalated support to see what's wrong with this, someone I can discuss IPs, gateway IPs, pings, trace routes with.
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