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Fibre optic
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Registered: ‎22-06-2012
Message 11 of 36 (425 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues

Wouldn't go with 'leading the way' so much... My understanding of the reason that caused ISP's to allow you to use other modems from a supported list is because American ISP's charge rental on the kit, so they were pressured into allowing users to supply their own.

As VM don't charge you for that rental then the same amount of pressure is not there. Also, there seems to be a large amount of cables providers across the pond, whereas in the UK there is one, so unfortunately that means the competition uses another technology so there's no like for like competitor, which means they sometimes seem to be a law to themselves.

Either way, this is very much a dictatorship, so unfortunately I think we're stuck with waiting for a fix or a new hub (which hopefully isn't a puma 7).

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Fibre optic
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Message 12 of 36 (395 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues


Guybrush85 wrote:

As VM don't charge you for that rental


I am pretty sure they do, they just don't put it as separate item on your bill.

Horrorz of hacked modems didn't seem to blow up US cable infra. Also VM may be blissfully unaware (?), but having just one possible device make it easier to hack and know all odds and ends about it, and Superhubs are not very locked down (they run standard Linux for gods sake so its only matter of connecting the serial console). Generally the providers have found that its much easier to protect the port than trying to protect the modem - after all it does not matter how hacked your modem is if your ISP does not send any data in your cable end Smiley Wink

Its not a dictatorship, its a wondrous "legal monopoly"... Where I live, they actually excluded from BT BDUK FTTC rollout - "because your area already have superfast provider available". Yeah, you already have monopoly here, no need to add unnecessary competition and make them too nervous...

 

 

 

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On our wavelength
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Message 13 of 36 (363 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues

Please note that this is a "campaign" posting specifically to bring about change [which is for the benefit of Virgin Media ultimately in terms of customer satisfaction and retention] and not merely a request of Virgin to voluntarily do it. The Puma 6 issue is the nail in the coffin for "just switch to modem mode" as the answer to all HUB support issues!

The goal is to force Virgin down a particular path by using the US model as the gold standard and by ultimately getting as many customer complaints as possible reported to OFCOM as the stick. You need to remember that soon we could very well march in droves to other providers once "full fibre to premise" is rolled out by OpenReach in the next few years, so if Virgin are simply not interested in retaining thier Internet customers, and add to that cord cutting and alternate programming providers like youtube and Netflix, and expanded Freeview Live channels, then the Virgin Media cable business might be ultimately doomed to extinction if customers are not happy with the services that are being provided. So unfortunately I have to disagree fundamentally with your reply to point 1 “Don't think that would ever happen” because customers voting by complaining to OFCOM and possibly switching providers, are probably the factors that will ultimately decide if we will get freedom of modem choice or not! 

Virgin Media has the highest level of “Customers with a reason to complain” out of all the major UK Internet providers monitored by OFCOM. It also has the third from bottom position of “Satisfaction with complaints handling” at only 54% satisfaction, and therefore 46% of customers are not satisfied. I wonder how many of those complaints are specifically about the Virgin Hubs? Virgin have the opportunity to improve those stats by providing the customer the choice to effectively contract out of modem rental and the poor support that we are getting.

See the last bullet point below under “Buy your own modem” for how spectrum and TWC deal with all the issues you raised, or could possibly raise, in one simple sentence. There is currently no UK stock of modems because Virgin are not allowing their use, so that is therefore merely a deflecting argument.

For every argument Virgin could possibly put forward not to do this the reply is to tell how it's “already” begin done by others. Perhaps Virgin should send a few folks to the states to learn how to do it and what is involved in reality, seriously! Here’s how others are dealing with the issue and is exactly what we should all expect to see happen with Virgin Media.

https://www.timewarnercable.com/en/support/internet/topics/lease-or-buy-modem.htm

Lease a Modem from Us:

  • We provide the appropriate modem for your Internet service plan and speed tier.

  • Optimal security setting is set by default.

  • We make upgraded equipment available to you at no additional cost if we update Internet plan speeds and when technology improves.

  • Technical support for your modem is guaranteed and available 24/7.

  • Return equipment if you cancel your service.

Buy Your Own Modem:

  • Purchase your modem from a local or online retailer.

  • You are responsible for security settings on your wireless network.

  • You may have to purchase a new modem to optimize performance whenever we upgrade speed tiers.

  • Technical support from us for purchased modems is not provided. You are responsible for the modem if it malfunctions.

  • Our Internet customers are required to use an authorized device that will not cause harm to our network.

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On our wavelength
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Registered: a month ago
Message 14 of 36 (354 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues

I don't want to go on about this too much as the argument is really so dead simple as per my original example, we should be able to connect our own modem to the Virgin infrastructure. So please do either complain to OFCOM if you are reading this thread, or please leave Virgin Media when Fibre-to-The-Premise FTTP [not to be confused with FTTC] is in your area, you decide.

On the support cost debate, Virgin Media don't provide modems and support staff for free so there is indeed a rebate to be had no matter how small it might actually be. It's for OFCOM to decide what is a reasonable figure to give back to the customer. In the US typically $10 per month is the figure quoted for rental and support costs. Perfectly good modem's are costing only $80 so there is potential for real savings to be had over time.

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Superuser
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Registered: ‎08-06-2010
Message 15 of 36 (342 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues

At present the operator’s roll-out of 1Gbps capable FTTP technology is expected to reach 2 million homes and businesses by 2020 while their ‘up to’ 330Mbps hybrid-fibre G.fast solution will do 10 million premises by the same date and many more by 2025. so might be awhile for your area to be get fttp.. as for getting own modems that replace the hub isn't just matter of flicking a switch, would require a complete redesign of authentication from the current BPI+ system, and the countless possible thousands of man hours of work required on the backend systems
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On our wavelength
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Message 16 of 36 (329 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues

As I said TWC / Spectrum are doing this already so you are simply saying that Virgin have not yet invested in updating infrastructure and may not do for some time due to it being too difficult? I'm really not interested in getting any details of the difficulty because priorities can change if this becomes mandatory, I have logged a complaint with OFCOM Reference 00465924 and will report back what they say.

If others folks are interested, log your complaint here: https://ofcomforms.secure.force.com/formentry/SitesFormCCTMonitoring

"Although Ofcom cannot investigate individual cases, the information you provide will help us monitor consumer issues, and could lead to us launching an investigation into a particular company."

The more folks who complain then the more likely that OFCOM will "launching an investigation into a particular company" i.e. Virgin Media.

 

 

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Superuser
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Registered: ‎08-06-2010
Message 17 of 36 (330 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues


paultechy wrote:
At present the operator’s roll-out of 1Gbps capable FTTP technology is expected to reach 2 million homes and businesses by 2020 while their ‘up to’ 330Mbps hybrid-fibre G.fast solution will do 10 million premises by the same date and many more by 2025.

that was for other ISP's like BT etc.. there is a lot of work going behind the scenes to switch over to docsis 3.1 no official timescale has been released that i currently know of you could take a look at thread -> http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/Tech-Chatter/Docsis-3-1-deployment-and-Hub-4-end-of-2017-and-201...

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Fibre optic
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Registered: ‎31-07-2015
Message 18 of 36 (322 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues

[ Edited ]

Most big bit of DOCSIS 3.1 that it will require CMTS upgrades. It will take quite a while, and I would assume VM will roll it out first only in areas where its direly needed due to congestion. At least not before they start offering gigabit speed packages, which will take some years until some competition in speeds will arrive.

Above linked post is still mostly speculation and trying to extrapolate other countries broadband practices unto UK's which I think is wrong. That they all "Liberty Global" now does not mean there will be a global rollout.

 

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On our wavelength
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Message 19 of 36 (270 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues

You are taking the wrong view on this by only looking at the UK market. We can't be so inward looking, we need to compete in the world economy especially taking any advantage we can get. The enhanced upload and download speeds would be very important for folks who work from home and send their work to customers electronically for one example. Also Virgin might find themselves subject to takeover if a company like Comcast can see a profit in doing so.

Comcast plan to roll-out DOCSIS 3.1 by the end of 2017 [yes this year!] with more US cable companies to follow within three years, why are we needing to wait 8 years for 1G to reach most folks in the UK? Comcast first offered DOCSIS 3.1 to it's customers back in January 2017 yet Virgin can only start to talk about it now with no time-scales being announced???

Another reason to complain to OFCOM is to counter Virgin's protectionist stance on this, if indeed they would delay DOCSIS 3.1 implementation for no good reason, then the real reason might be to force customers to use slower connections longer than necessary in order to protect the cable TV business from large increases in steamed programming from other providers and that leads to a serious accusation of stifling competition that OFCOM will need to investigate.

Comcast's view is that the infrastructure investment which is currently ~$8 billion for 2017 alone will pay dividends from customers paying more for the enhanced services, so time-scales and priorities can in fact be changed at the will of the cable company and it's investors or by the regulator. Virgin seriously need to get a grip on the facts and figures and spring into action and stop procrastinating otherwise OFCOM needs to force their hand.

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Alessandro Volta
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Message 20 of 36 (262 Views)

Re: Intel Puma 6 Chipset issues


colinsuk wrote:

You are taking the wrong view on this by only looking at the UK market. We can't be so inward looking, we need to compete in the world economy especially taking any advantage we can get. The enhanced upload and download speeds would be very important for folks who work from home and send their work to customers electronically for one example. Also Virgin might find themselves subject to takeover if a company like Comcast can see a profit in doing so.

[SEPH]: I think you make some of this up as you go along.  OFCOM (a UK regulator) in one breath and arguing beyond the UK in another.  Our competitiveness in the world economy is not affected by the difference in speed between the various VM tiers under DOCSIS 3.0.  Those businesses that need to take serious account of latency, e.g. safety of life industries, financial trading etc., have their own uncontended infrastructures.

Comcast plan to roll-out DOCSIS 3.1 by the end of 2017 [yes this year!] with more US cable companies to follow within three years, why are we needing to wait 8 years for 1G to reach most folks in the UK? Comcast first offered DOCSIS 3.1 to it's customers back in January 2017 yet Virgin can only start to talk about it now with no time-scales being announced???

[SEPH]: So what?  Are you suggesting that US business will be more competitive and have more advantage because Comcast customers will have DOCSIS 3.1 this year?  VM will soon be rolling out DOCSIS 3,1, starting with high density areas and, as with DOCSIS 3 seven years ago, they'll have their entire footprint covered in due course.  And how will 1Gbps on a domestic network make us more competitive?

Another reason to complain to OFCOM is to counter Virgin's protectionist stance on this, if indeed they would delay DOCSIS 3.1 implementation for no good reason, then the real reason might be to force customers to use slower connections longer than necessary in order to protect the cable TV business from large increases in steamed programming from other providers and that leads to a serious accusation of stifling competition that OFCOM will need to investigate.

[SEPH]: You're not in the real world.  DOCSIS 3.1 is VM/LG's technical and investment decision and has nothing to do with the regulator in your mentioned context. You'll have an easier time convincing OFCOM that VM are sweating their landline asset (and then so what) than protecting the Cable TV business (which also uses DOCSIS 3.x).  The only valid point in that context that you might care to make is that there is only one cable TV/broadband provider (DOCSIS) and that can of worms would hit access to VM's private ducting and so on.  Your vision here is that of fantasy.

Comcast's view is that the infrastructure investment which is currently ~$8 billion for 2017 alone will pay dividends from customers paying more for the enhanced services, so time-scales and priorities can in fact be changed at the will of the cable company and it's investors or by the regulator. Virgin seriously need to get a grip on the facts and figures and spring into action and stop procrastinating otherwise OFCOM needs to force their hand.

[SEPH]: Comcast have 23 million subscribers and VM have c. 6 million cable subscribers.  The USA is a totally different geographic entity from the UK.  Comcast are present in a smaller proportional footprint in the USA than Virgin Media.  Topology forces different and disparate investment strategies.  It's one thing envying the "lucky" Comcast customers who can get "up to" 2 Gbps, being rolled out in their small footprint in various (not all) states.  It's quite another to expect VM's more tightly bound national infrastructure to be delivered for higher speeds in the same way.  Sure VM's local hub structure enables them to plan locally but remember that TV is fed from just two head ends (afaik) which is not the case in the USA.   OFCOM will see absolutely no reason to force VM's hand; they provide competition to FTTC which is a lame product anyway.  You pray OFGCOM's name in aid - but without any valid reason for so doing.

 


 

Seph - ( DEFROCKED - My advice is at your risk)